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cannot upgrade db from 7.0 to 8.0

7 posts in General Discussion Last posting was on 2007-10-15 16:26:14.0Z
Chris Posted on 2007-10-08 07:34:51.0Z
From: "Chris" <Chris@gmail.com>
Newsgroups: ianywhere.public.general
Subject: cannot upgrade db from 7.0 to 8.0
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I have a database created in earlier version (v7.0) and wish to have it
updated to latest version

Upgrade from sybase central completed successfully but properties window
shows that the version of the db doesn't change (still v 7.0)
Also whilst dbsrv8 is loading the server, there was a line that says **Note:
Database was created using older software and may benefit from being
rebuilt**

any ideas why upgrade process silently failed?

ASA 8.0.3.5002

Chris


Breck Carter [Team iAnywhere] Posted on 2007-10-08 15:35:21.0Z
From: "Breck Carter [Team iAnywhere]" <NOSPAM__bcarter@risingroad.com>
Newsgroups: ianywhere.public.general
Subject: Re: cannot upgrade db from 7.0 to 8.0
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The "upgrade" process probably worked, but it really doesn't do much;
it has always been an inadequate solution... its speed is completely
misleading. The only way to take advantage of all new features of a
new version is to unload the old database, create a new database with
the new version, and reload.

Sadly, the Version 8 Help for the wizard doesn't tell you this.
However, the Help for the *command line* version of the same thing
(dbupgrad.exe) does:

=====
Adaptive Server Anywhere Database Administration Guide
15. Database Administration Utilities
The Upgrade utility
Upgrading a database using the dbupgrad command-line utility
...
Not all features made available
Features that require a physical reorganization of the database file
are not made available by dbupgrad. Such features include index
enhancements and changes in data storage. To obtain the benefits of
these enhancements, you must unload and reload your database.
For more information, see Upgrading the database file format.
=====

FWIW the same is true of most DBMS products... new versions come with
requirements to rebuild your database. Most products don't even *have*
this so-called upgrade process, and I wish SQL Anywhere never had it
either.

Breck

On 8 Oct 2007 00:34:51 -0700, "Chris" <Chris@gmail.com> wrote:

>I have a database created in earlier version (v7.0) and wish to have it
>updated to latest version
>
>Upgrade from sybase central completed successfully but properties window
>shows that the version of the db doesn't change (still v 7.0)
>Also whilst dbsrv8 is loading the server, there was a line that says **Note:
>Database was created using older software and may benefit from being
>rebuilt**
>
>any ideas why upgrade process silently failed?
>
>ASA 8.0.3.5002
>
>Chris
>
>
>

--
Breck Carter [Team iAnywhere]
RisingRoad SQL Anywhere and MobiLink Professional Services
www.risingroad.com
The book: http://www.risingroad.com/SQL_Anywhere_Studio_9_Developers_Guide.html
breck.carter@risingroad.com


Chris Posted on 2007-10-09 03:38:25.0Z
From: "Chris" <Chris@gmail.com>
Newsgroups: ianywhere.public.general
References: <4709dd9b@forums-1-dub> <p0jkg3ttnrt02vl6n347q2utud8cbc3mic@4ax.com>
Subject: Re: cannot upgrade db from 7.0 to 8.0
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thanks for your explanation

"Breck Carter [Team iAnywhere]" <NOSPAM__bcarter@risingroad.com> wrote in
message news:p0jkg3ttnrt02vl6n347q2utud8cbc3mic@4ax.com...
> The "upgrade" process probably worked, but it really doesn't do much;
> it has always been an inadequate solution... its speed is completely
> misleading. The only way to take advantage of all new features of a
> new version is to unload the old database, create a new database with
> the new version, and reload.
>
> Sadly, the Version 8 Help for the wizard doesn't tell you this.
> However, the Help for the *command line* version of the same thing
> (dbupgrad.exe) does:
>
> =====
> Adaptive Server Anywhere Database Administration Guide
> 15. Database Administration Utilities
> The Upgrade utility
> Upgrading a database using the dbupgrad command-line utility
> ...
> Not all features made available
> Features that require a physical reorganization of the database file
> are not made available by dbupgrad. Such features include index
> enhancements and changes in data storage. To obtain the benefits of
> these enhancements, you must unload and reload your database.
> For more information, see Upgrading the database file format.
> =====
>
> FWIW the same is true of most DBMS products... new versions come with
> requirements to rebuild your database. Most products don't even *have*
> this so-called upgrade process, and I wish SQL Anywhere never had it
> either.
>
> Breck
>
>
>
> On 8 Oct 2007 00:34:51 -0700, "Chris" <Chris@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>>I have a database created in earlier version (v7.0) and wish to have it
>>updated to latest version
>>
>>Upgrade from sybase central completed successfully but properties window
>>shows that the version of the db doesn't change (still v 7.0)
>>Also whilst dbsrv8 is loading the server, there was a line that says
>>**Note:
>>Database was created using older software and may benefit from being
>>rebuilt**
>>
>>any ideas why upgrade process silently failed?
>>
>>ASA 8.0.3.5002
>>
>>Chris
>>
>>
>>
>
> --
> Breck Carter [Team iAnywhere]
> RisingRoad SQL Anywhere and MobiLink Professional Services
> www.risingroad.com
> The book:
> http://www.risingroad.com/SQL_Anywhere_Studio_9_Developers_Guide.html
> breck.carter@risingroad.com


Shao Chan Posted on 2007-10-09 10:40:10.0Z
From: "Shao Chan" <noemail@noemail.com>
Newsgroups: ianywhere.public.general
References: <4709dd9b@forums-1-dub> <p0jkg3ttnrt02vl6n347q2utud8cbc3mic@4ax.com>
Subject: Re: cannot upgrade db from 7.0 to 8.0
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Hi Breck,

> FWIW the same is true of most DBMS products... new versions come with
> requirements to rebuild your database. Most products don't even *have*
> this so-called upgrade process, and I wish SQL Anywhere never had it
> either.
>

As far as I am aware, all database vendors have upgrade utilities and all
except possibly SQL Anywhere upgrade with full features. It is never the
most recommended approach because of fragmentation and reclaiming space etc,
but the utilities are always there.

Which databases where you thinking of otherwise?

Cheers,

Shao


"Breck Carter [Team iAnywhere]" <NOSPAM__bcarter@risingroad.com> wrote in
message news:p0jkg3ttnrt02vl6n347q2utud8cbc3mic@4ax.com...
> The "upgrade" process probably worked, but it really doesn't do much;
> it has always been an inadequate solution... its speed is completely
> misleading. The only way to take advantage of all new features of a
> new version is to unload the old database, create a new database with
> the new version, and reload.
>
> Sadly, the Version 8 Help for the wizard doesn't tell you this.
> However, the Help for the *command line* version of the same thing
> (dbupgrad.exe) does:
>
> =====
> Adaptive Server Anywhere Database Administration Guide
> 15. Database Administration Utilities
> The Upgrade utility
> Upgrading a database using the dbupgrad command-line utility
> ...
> Not all features made available
> Features that require a physical reorganization of the database file
> are not made available by dbupgrad. Such features include index
> enhancements and changes in data storage. To obtain the benefits of
> these enhancements, you must unload and reload your database.
> For more information, see Upgrading the database file format.
> =====
>
> FWIW the same is true of most DBMS products... new versions come with
> requirements to rebuild your database. Most products don't even *have*
> this so-called upgrade process, and I wish SQL Anywhere never had it
> either.
>
> Breck
>
>
>
> On 8 Oct 2007 00:34:51 -0700, "Chris" <Chris@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>>I have a database created in earlier version (v7.0) and wish to have it
>>updated to latest version
>>
>>Upgrade from sybase central completed successfully but properties window
>>shows that the version of the db doesn't change (still v 7.0)
>>Also whilst dbsrv8 is loading the server, there was a line that says
>>**Note:
>>Database was created using older software and may benefit from being
>>rebuilt**
>>
>>any ideas why upgrade process silently failed?
>>
>>ASA 8.0.3.5002
>>
>>Chris
>>
>>
>>
>
> --
> Breck Carter [Team iAnywhere]
> RisingRoad SQL Anywhere and MobiLink Professional Services
> www.risingroad.com
> The book:
> http://www.risingroad.com/SQL_Anywhere_Studio_9_Developers_Guide.html
> breck.carter@risingroad.com


Breck Carter [Team iAnywhere] Posted on 2007-10-10 17:35:48.0Z
From: "Breck Carter [Team iAnywhere]" <NOSPAM__bcarter@risingroad.com>
Newsgroups: ianywhere.public.general
Subject: Re: cannot upgrade db from 7.0 to 8.0
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I am happy to stand corrected, if you can show me one other RDBMS
product that has a single, one-step executable utility that runs in a
matter of seconds no matter how big the database is, requiring no user
input, which "upgrades" from any previous release to the current one
(understand that I am not saying that is a good thing to do, it
isn't).

Oracle, for example, has *massive* amounts of documentation to read
when you come to the point of upgrading from one release to another...
http://download.oracle.com/docs/cd/B28359_01/server.111/b28300/intro.htm#i1008293

With most SQL Anywhere databases, the dbunload-dbinit-dbisql-reload
path is quite simple, and dbunload can even be used to do the whole
process in one step.

But, maybe I'm missing the point...

Breck

On 9 Oct 2007 03:40:10 -0700, "Shao Chan" <noemail@noemail.com> wrote:

>Hi Breck,
>
>> FWIW the same is true of most DBMS products... new versions come with
>> requirements to rebuild your database. Most products don't even *have*
>> this so-called upgrade process, and I wish SQL Anywhere never had it
>> either.
>>
>
>As far as I am aware, all database vendors have upgrade utilities and all
>except possibly SQL Anywhere upgrade with full features. It is never the
>most recommended approach because of fragmentation and reclaiming space etc,
>but the utilities are always there.
>
>Which databases where you thinking of otherwise?
>
>Cheers,
>
>Shao
>
>
>"Breck Carter [Team iAnywhere]" <NOSPAM__bcarter@risingroad.com> wrote in
>message news:p0jkg3ttnrt02vl6n347q2utud8cbc3mic@4ax.com...
>> The "upgrade" process probably worked, but it really doesn't do much;
>> it has always been an inadequate solution... its speed is completely
>> misleading. The only way to take advantage of all new features of a
>> new version is to unload the old database, create a new database with
>> the new version, and reload.
>>
>> Sadly, the Version 8 Help for the wizard doesn't tell you this.
>> However, the Help for the *command line* version of the same thing
>> (dbupgrad.exe) does:
>>
>> =====
>> Adaptive Server Anywhere Database Administration Guide
>> 15. Database Administration Utilities
>> The Upgrade utility
>> Upgrading a database using the dbupgrad command-line utility
>> ...
>> Not all features made available
>> Features that require a physical reorganization of the database file
>> are not made available by dbupgrad. Such features include index
>> enhancements and changes in data storage. To obtain the benefits of
>> these enhancements, you must unload and reload your database.
>> For more information, see Upgrading the database file format.
>> =====
>>
>> FWIW the same is true of most DBMS products... new versions come with
>> requirements to rebuild your database. Most products don't even *have*
>> this so-called upgrade process, and I wish SQL Anywhere never had it
>> either.
>>
>> Breck
>>
>>
>>
>> On 8 Oct 2007 00:34:51 -0700, "Chris" <Chris@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>>I have a database created in earlier version (v7.0) and wish to have it
>>>updated to latest version
>>>
>>>Upgrade from sybase central completed successfully but properties window
>>>shows that the version of the db doesn't change (still v 7.0)
>>>Also whilst dbsrv8 is loading the server, there was a line that says
>>>**Note:
>>>Database was created using older software and may benefit from being
>>>rebuilt**
>>>
>>>any ideas why upgrade process silently failed?
>>>
>>>ASA 8.0.3.5002
>>>
>>>Chris
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>> --
>> Breck Carter [Team iAnywhere]
>> RisingRoad SQL Anywhere and MobiLink Professional Services
>> www.risingroad.com
>> The book:
>> http://www.risingroad.com/SQL_Anywhere_Studio_9_Developers_Guide.html
>> breck.carter@risingroad.com
>

--
Breck Carter [Team iAnywhere]
RisingRoad SQL Anywhere and MobiLink Professional Services
www.risingroad.com
The book: http://www.risingroad.com/SQL_Anywhere_Studio_9_Developers_Guide.html
breck.carter@risingroad.com


Shao Chan Posted on 2007-10-15 13:27:03.0Z
From: "Shao Chan" <noemail@noemail.com>
Newsgroups: ianywhere.public.general
References: <4709dd9b@forums-1-dub> <p0jkg3ttnrt02vl6n347q2utud8cbc3mic@4ax.com> <470b5a8a$1@forums-1-dub> <4k2qg35fcekkp8sc8hmd325t0fu7cpap5n@4ax.com>
Subject: Re: cannot upgrade db from 7.0 to 8.0
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Hi Breck,

The documentation, although will go through a series of issues, concerns and
precautions, will have a single upgrade command to upgrade the database much
like SQL Anywhere. I fail to see how it could possibly be split across
multiple commands that are tedious to execute.

As for fast, none of the database vendors are really that fast. There are
compromises. I mainly use Progress databases, and when performing an
upgrade (as opposed to an unload/reload), new indices added for example
won't be active. This allows the database to be upgraded fast and brought
back online and then the new indices activated separately. However, in
terms of features, you certainly don't lose any features by doing an
upgrade.

I also don't think that this is true of Oracle.

Now, I do apologise if I missed the context of your original statement if
you say that there is something special about SQL Anywhere's upgrade command
sacrificing features for speed. However, all database vendors do have
upgrade utilities, and yes the all require the database to be brought
offline and the command executed, but there is nothing special about it.

Cheers,

Shao

"Breck Carter [Team iAnywhere]" <NOSPAM__bcarter@risingroad.com> wrote in
message news:4k2qg35fcekkp8sc8hmd325t0fu7cpap5n@4ax.com...
>I am happy to stand corrected, if you can show me one other RDBMS
> product that has a single, one-step executable utility that runs in a
> matter of seconds no matter how big the database is, requiring no user
> input, which "upgrades" from any previous release to the current one
> (understand that I am not saying that is a good thing to do, it
> isn't).
>
> Oracle, for example, has *massive* amounts of documentation to read
> when you come to the point of upgrading from one release to another...
> http://download.oracle.com/docs/cd/B28359_01/server.111/b28300/intro.htm#i1008293
>
> With most SQL Anywhere databases, the dbunload-dbinit-dbisql-reload
> path is quite simple, and dbunload can even be used to do the whole
> process in one step.
>
> But, maybe I'm missing the point...
>
> Breck
>
>
>
> On 9 Oct 2007 03:40:10 -0700, "Shao Chan" <noemail@noemail.com> wrote:
>
>>Hi Breck,
>>
>>> FWIW the same is true of most DBMS products... new versions come with
>>> requirements to rebuild your database. Most products don't even *have*
>>> this so-called upgrade process, and I wish SQL Anywhere never had it
>>> either.
>>>
>>
>>As far as I am aware, all database vendors have upgrade utilities and all
>>except possibly SQL Anywhere upgrade with full features. It is never the
>>most recommended approach because of fragmentation and reclaiming space
>>etc,
>>but the utilities are always there.
>>
>>Which databases where you thinking of otherwise?
>>
>>Cheers,
>>
>>Shao
>>
>>
>>"Breck Carter [Team iAnywhere]" <NOSPAM__bcarter@risingroad.com> wrote in
>>message news:p0jkg3ttnrt02vl6n347q2utud8cbc3mic@4ax.com...
>>> The "upgrade" process probably worked, but it really doesn't do much;
>>> it has always been an inadequate solution... its speed is completely
>>> misleading. The only way to take advantage of all new features of a
>>> new version is to unload the old database, create a new database with
>>> the new version, and reload.
>>>
>>> Sadly, the Version 8 Help for the wizard doesn't tell you this.
>>> However, the Help for the *command line* version of the same thing
>>> (dbupgrad.exe) does:
>>>
>>> =====
>>> Adaptive Server Anywhere Database Administration Guide
>>> 15. Database Administration Utilities
>>> The Upgrade utility
>>> Upgrading a database using the dbupgrad command-line utility
>>> ...
>>> Not all features made available
>>> Features that require a physical reorganization of the database file
>>> are not made available by dbupgrad. Such features include index
>>> enhancements and changes in data storage. To obtain the benefits of
>>> these enhancements, you must unload and reload your database.
>>> For more information, see Upgrading the database file format.
>>> =====
>>>
>>> FWIW the same is true of most DBMS products... new versions come with
>>> requirements to rebuild your database. Most products don't even *have*
>>> this so-called upgrade process, and I wish SQL Anywhere never had it
>>> either.
>>>
>>> Breck
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On 8 Oct 2007 00:34:51 -0700, "Chris" <Chris@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>>I have a database created in earlier version (v7.0) and wish to have it
>>>>updated to latest version
>>>>
>>>>Upgrade from sybase central completed successfully but properties window
>>>>shows that the version of the db doesn't change (still v 7.0)
>>>>Also whilst dbsrv8 is loading the server, there was a line that says
>>>>**Note:
>>>>Database was created using older software and may benefit from being
>>>>rebuilt**
>>>>
>>>>any ideas why upgrade process silently failed?
>>>>
>>>>ASA 8.0.3.5002
>>>>
>>>>Chris
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> Breck Carter [Team iAnywhere]
>>> RisingRoad SQL Anywhere and MobiLink Professional Services
>>> www.risingroad.com
>>> The book:
>>> http://www.risingroad.com/SQL_Anywhere_Studio_9_Developers_Guide.html
>>> breck.carter@risingroad.com
>>
>
> --
> Breck Carter [Team iAnywhere]
> RisingRoad SQL Anywhere and MobiLink Professional Services
> www.risingroad.com
> The book:
> http://www.risingroad.com/SQL_Anywhere_Studio_9_Developers_Guide.html
> breck.carter@risingroad.com


Breck Carter [Team iAnywhere] Posted on 2007-10-15 16:26:14.0Z
From: "Breck Carter [Team iAnywhere]" <NOSPAM__bcarter@risingroad.com>
Newsgroups: ianywhere.public.general
Subject: Re: cannot upgrade db from 7.0 to 8.0
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On 15 Oct 2007 06:27:03 -0700, "Shao Chan" <noemail@noemail.com>

wrote:

>there is something special about SQL Anywhere's upgrade command
>sacrificing features for speed

That was my entire point, that the dbunload.exe program should be used
to upgrade SQL Anywhere database. I stand by my claim that no other
vendor has a product like dbupgrad.exe, nor should they.

Breck

--
Breck Carter [Team iAnywhere]
RisingRoad SQL Anywhere and MobiLink Professional Services
www.risingroad.com
The book: http://www.risingroad.com/SQL_Anywhere_Studio_9_Developers_Guide.html
breck.carter@risingroad.com