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Welcome

19 posts in Commercial ISV's Last posting was on 2008-04-07 12:58:28.0Z
John Strano[Sybase] Posted on 2008-01-29 12:22:44.0Z
From: "John Strano[Sybase]" <nichtspamjstrano@csi.com>
Newsgroups: sybase.public.commercial-isv.general
Subject: Welcome
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Message-ID: <479f1a94$1@forums-1-dub>
Date: 29 Jan 2008 04:22:44 -0800
X-Trace: forums-1-dub 1201609364 10.22.241.152 (29 Jan 2008 04:22:44 -0800)
X-Original-Trace: 29 Jan 2008 04:22:44 -0800, vip152.sybase.com
X-Authenticated-User: TeamSybase
Path: forums-1-dub!not-for-mail
Xref: forums-1-dub sybase.public.commercial-isv.general:3
Article PK: 103724

Are you an ISV?
Do you build commercial solutions using Sybase products?

Have you ever wanted to regularly communicate with your peers in an open
forum?
Now you can.

Possible topics about which you may want the
opinion and experience of your peers...

- Marketing Your Software: Internet Business Models
- How do I design visually stunning applications?
- Sources for Components, Services
- "Automated Testing Tools I have Loved"
- How to Create a Trial Version of Your Software
- How to Enact a License in commercial applications
- How to Certify Your Product for a specific OS
- How Do I Limit My Fiduciary and Legal Culpability?
- Disaster Recovery: How Much Redundancy is Enough?
- Does SOA Yet Have a Place in a Commercial Solution?
- How Can I Implement SaaS Into My Current Solutions?

Here is the most likely place to find who solved the problem you're
experiencing today...six months ago.
The purpose of this newsgroup is to provide a discussion space for
those who build products or ship products with Sybase offerings.
This forum is not meant to be a replacement for or an alternative to
technical support, but has been established by Sybase as a means
of providing a vehicle for its customers and prospects to openly
and freely exchange information and ideas.
Please feel free to post questions and to post answers for any
questions where you may be of help.

Please post and respond to questions in a professional, constructive manner.
When posting a question, please wait 24 hours before reposting so that users
have a chance
to read the question.

Welcome!

Forum Purpose
--------------------

This forum was established by Sybase as a means of providing a vehicle for
its customers and prospects to openly and freely exchange information and
ideas. It is neither an alternative to, nor a replacement for a Customer
Support Contract.

1. This is NOT a Sybase technical support forum and it is not the purpose
of this forum to allow customers to get free technical support from Sybase.
It is a place for users to help each other and exchange problems solutions,
information, ideas, etc.

2. Sybase has no obligation to provide questions, problems, or provide
anything other than a moderator to monitor the forum and insure its
operation and availability, exchange problems solutions, information, ideas,
etc. They do strive, however, to do much more than that as resources
permit.

3. Sybase executives may monitor the forum to observe customer reaction to
the product, keep up with users thoughts for new features, or offer
executive opinions and viewpoints. Sybase employees may also assist on the
forum when they have time available. They will offer help but may not be
available on a regular basis based on their workload.

4. Sybase has selected a technically astute group of users to offer
assistance to other Sybase users. The name of this group is
TeamSybase. The moderator(s) of this forums is(are) member(s) of that
group. Generally, neither they nor the other members of TeamSybase are
Sybase employees, nor are they paid for their services in maintaining the
forum. And, while they may answer questions in the forum from time to time,
they are not responsible for ensuring that all questions receive answers.

Guidelines
--------------

Please bear in mind that this is a moderated forum. As a result, it
operates somewhat differently than a typical unmoderated newsgroup.

1. If you're using a company id, please post your name at the end of the
message so that others may know who to address when sending an response. We
would appreciate you using your full (real) name.

2. Please post the same question once in the forum that appears most
appropriate and allow 36-72 hours for a response.

3. Advertising of any kind should be limited to the forums dedicated to
that purpose (i.e., news.3rd_party_products, news.job_postings, etc.).
Spamming of the forum will not be tolerated.

4. Profanity, obscenities, and abuse of forum members will not be
tolerated.

5. Please refrain from sending "thanks" in the forum. Anyone desiring to
thank the person assisting them should feel free to do so, but we would ask
that this be done via e-mail to minimize traffic and allow members to review
both problems and solutions.

6. Please refrain from sending personal messages in the forum. These
conversations are more properly carried on in e-mail.

7. This forum is not particularly designed for the transfer of files.
Therefore, if you need to make files accessible to other people, please
handle it through private email or by making the file available on an ftp
site or codexchange.sybase.com. Extremely large messages, particularly
those containing embedded files, will be deleted without notice.

8. Please put specifics on the message header(not "Help", "Bug", "Urgent"
or vague subject headers). People often only review headers for messages
they are interested in. This is in your best interest in getting the most
out of your message posting.

9. Please do not ask more than one question per message. If you have five
questions, please post five messages. That way, duplication of answers for
one problem and overlooked questions will be minimized.

10. When replying, ALWAYS include part of the message in your reply. Some of
us CAN'T remember what happened five minutes ago, let alone yesterday.

11. The forum is primarily intended to assist Sybase end-users in
obtaining the maximum benefit from its products. It is not intended for
more
general discussions, such as features of various products, product
comparisons, etc. Please post messages of that type in more appropriate
arenas, such as an public, unmoderated newsgroup.

John Strano
TeamSybase
Sybase Technology Evangelist


Ken Judkins Posted on 2008-01-29 18:46:14.0Z
From: "Ken Judkins" <nospam@nospam.com>
Newsgroups: sybase.public.commercial-isv.general
References: <479f1a94$1@forums-1-dub>
Subject: Re: Welcome
Lines: 167
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Message-ID: <479f7476$1@forums-1-dub>
Date: 29 Jan 2008 10:46:14 -0800
X-Trace: forums-1-dub 1201632374 10.22.241.152 (29 Jan 2008 10:46:14 -0800)
X-Original-Trace: 29 Jan 2008 10:46:14 -0800, vip152.sybase.com
Path: forums-1-dub!not-for-mail
Xref: forums-1-dub sybase.public.commercial-isv.general:4
Article PK: 103727

Thanks to Sybase for the Commercial-ISV newsgroup! I hope having a forum
outside the "technical details" areas will help people like me get a product
to market.

I'd like to create applications I can sell over the Internet. I have many
questions because I have never done anything like that before. Actually,
John, you posed many of my questions in your original post! I'll split them
into separate threads when I make my posts.

As I was thinking over the questions I have, I saw the benefit of this
newsgroup for Sybase. I have PowerBuilder 9 Enterprise. Once I am
successfully selling a few products on a regular basis, I'd like to upgrade
to PB 11. The advice and mentoring participants in this newsgroup provide
will be invaluable, and everybody will benefit.

Ken Judkins

"John Strano[Sybase]" <nichtspamjstrano@csi.com> wrote in message
news:479f1a94$1@forums-1-dub...
> Are you an ISV?
> Do you build commercial solutions using Sybase products?
>
> Have you ever wanted to regularly communicate with your peers in an open
> forum?
> Now you can.
>
> Possible topics about which you may want the
> opinion and experience of your peers...
>
> - Marketing Your Software: Internet Business Models
> - How do I design visually stunning applications?
> - Sources for Components, Services
> - "Automated Testing Tools I have Loved"
> - How to Create a Trial Version of Your Software
> - How to Enact a License in commercial applications
> - How to Certify Your Product for a specific OS
> - How Do I Limit My Fiduciary and Legal Culpability?
> - Disaster Recovery: How Much Redundancy is Enough?
> - Does SOA Yet Have a Place in a Commercial Solution?
> - How Can I Implement SaaS Into My Current Solutions?
>
> Here is the most likely place to find who solved the problem you're
> experiencing today...six months ago.
> The purpose of this newsgroup is to provide a discussion space for
> those who build products or ship products with Sybase offerings.
> This forum is not meant to be a replacement for or an alternative to
> technical support, but has been established by Sybase as a means
> of providing a vehicle for its customers and prospects to openly
> and freely exchange information and ideas.
> Please feel free to post questions and to post answers for any
> questions where you may be of help.
>
> Please post and respond to questions in a professional, constructive
> manner.
> When posting a question, please wait 24 hours before reposting so that
> users have a chance
> to read the question.
>
> Welcome!
>
> Forum Purpose
> --------------------
>
> This forum was established by Sybase as a means of providing a vehicle for
> its customers and prospects to openly and freely exchange information and
> ideas. It is neither an alternative to, nor a replacement for a Customer
> Support Contract.
>
> 1. This is NOT a Sybase technical support forum and it is not the purpose
> of this forum to allow customers to get free technical support from
> Sybase.
> It is a place for users to help each other and exchange problems
> solutions,
> information, ideas, etc.
>
> 2. Sybase has no obligation to provide questions, problems, or provide
> anything other than a moderator to monitor the forum and insure its
> operation and availability, exchange problems solutions, information,
> ideas,
> etc. They do strive, however, to do much more than that as resources
> permit.
>
> 3. Sybase executives may monitor the forum to observe customer reaction
> to
> the product, keep up with users thoughts for new features, or offer
> executive opinions and viewpoints. Sybase employees may also assist on
> the
> forum when they have time available. They will offer help but may not be
> available on a regular basis based on their workload.
>
> 4. Sybase has selected a technically astute group of users to offer
> assistance to other Sybase users. The name of this group is
> TeamSybase. The moderator(s) of this forums is(are) member(s) of that
> group. Generally, neither they nor the other members of TeamSybase are
> Sybase employees, nor are they paid for their services in maintaining the
> forum. And, while they may answer questions in the forum from time to
> time,
> they are not responsible for ensuring that all questions receive answers.
>
> Guidelines
> --------------
>
> Please bear in mind that this is a moderated forum. As a result, it
> operates somewhat differently than a typical unmoderated newsgroup.
>
> 1. If you're using a company id, please post your name at the end of the
> message so that others may know who to address when sending an response.
> We
> would appreciate you using your full (real) name.
>
> 2. Please post the same question once in the forum that appears most
> appropriate and allow 36-72 hours for a response.
>
> 3. Advertising of any kind should be limited to the forums dedicated to
> that purpose (i.e., news.3rd_party_products, news.job_postings, etc.).
> Spamming of the forum will not be tolerated.
>
> 4. Profanity, obscenities, and abuse of forum members will not be
> tolerated.
>
> 5. Please refrain from sending "thanks" in the forum. Anyone desiring to
> thank the person assisting them should feel free to do so, but we would
> ask
> that this be done via e-mail to minimize traffic and allow members to
> review
> both problems and solutions.
>
> 6. Please refrain from sending personal messages in the forum. These
> conversations are more properly carried on in e-mail.
>
> 7. This forum is not particularly designed for the transfer of files.
> Therefore, if you need to make files accessible to other people, please
> handle it through private email or by making the file available on an ftp
> site or codexchange.sybase.com. Extremely large messages, particularly
> those containing embedded files, will be deleted without notice.
>
> 8. Please put specifics on the message header(not "Help", "Bug", "Urgent"
> or vague subject headers). People often only review headers for messages
> they are interested in. This is in your best interest in getting the most
> out of your message posting.
>
> 9. Please do not ask more than one question per message. If you have
> five
> questions, please post five messages. That way, duplication of answers
> for
> one problem and overlooked questions will be minimized.
>
> 10. When replying, ALWAYS include part of the message in your reply. Some
> of
> us CAN'T remember what happened five minutes ago, let alone yesterday.
>
> 11. The forum is primarily intended to assist Sybase end-users in
> obtaining the maximum benefit from its products. It is not intended for
> more
> general discussions, such as features of various products, product
> comparisons, etc. Please post messages of that type in more appropriate
> arenas, such as an public, unmoderated newsgroup.
>
> John Strano
> TeamSybase
> Sybase Technology Evangelist
>
>


John Strano[Sybase] Posted on 2008-01-31 15:49:57.0Z
From: "John Strano[Sybase]" <nichtspamjstrano@csi.com>
Newsgroups: sybase.public.commercial-isv.general
References: <479f1a94$1@forums-1-dub> <479f7476$1@forums-1-dub>
Subject: Re: Welcome
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NNTP-Posting-Host: vip152.sybase.com
X-Original-NNTP-Posting-Host: vip152.sybase.com
Message-ID: <47a1ee25@forums-1-dub>
Date: 31 Jan 2008 07:49:57 -0800
X-Trace: forums-1-dub 1201794597 10.22.241.152 (31 Jan 2008 07:49:57 -0800)
X-Original-Trace: 31 Jan 2008 07:49:57 -0800, vip152.sybase.com
X-Authenticated-User: TeamSybase
Path: forums-1-dub!not-for-mail
Xref: forums-1-dub sybase.public.commercial-isv.general:11
Article PK: 103733


>> John, you posed many of my questions in your original post! I'll split
>> them into separate threads when I make my posts.

<G> Yes, please.

>> I have PowerBuilder 9 Enterprise. Once I am successfully selling a few
>> products on a regular basis, I'd like to upgrade to PB 11.

PowerBuilder 9 has been EOL for a while.
I'd hate for you to have a time-sensitive issue to solve
with a customer and not have us able to support you.

--
John Strano - Sybase Technology Evangelist


"Ken Judkins" <nospam@nospam.com> wrote in message
news:479f7476$1@forums-1-dub...
> Thanks to Sybase for the Commercial-ISV newsgroup! I hope having a forum
> outside the "technical details" areas will help people like me get a
> product to market.
>
> I'd like to create applications I can sell over the Internet. I have many
> questions because I have never done anything like that before. Actually,
> John, you posed many of my questions in your original post! I'll split
> them into separate threads when I make my posts.
>
> As I was thinking over the questions I have, I saw the benefit of this
> newsgroup for Sybase. I have PowerBuilder 9 Enterprise. Once I am
> successfully selling a few products on a regular basis, I'd like to
> upgrade to PB 11. The advice and mentoring participants in this newsgroup
> provide will be invaluable, and everybody will benefit.
>
> Ken Judkins
>
>
>
> "John Strano[Sybase]" <nichtspamjstrano@csi.com> wrote in message
> news:479f1a94$1@forums-1-dub...
>> Are you an ISV?
>> Do you build commercial solutions using Sybase products?
>>
>> Have you ever wanted to regularly communicate with your peers in an open
>> forum?
>> Now you can.
>>
>> Possible topics about which you may want the
>> opinion and experience of your peers...
>>
>> - Marketing Your Software: Internet Business Models
>> - How do I design visually stunning applications?
>> - Sources for Components, Services
>> - "Automated Testing Tools I have Loved"
>> - How to Create a Trial Version of Your Software
>> - How to Enact a License in commercial applications
>> - How to Certify Your Product for a specific OS
>> - How Do I Limit My Fiduciary and Legal Culpability?
>> - Disaster Recovery: How Much Redundancy is Enough?
>> - Does SOA Yet Have a Place in a Commercial Solution?
>> - How Can I Implement SaaS Into My Current Solutions?
>>
>> Here is the most likely place to find who solved the problem you're
>> experiencing today...six months ago.
>> The purpose of this newsgroup is to provide a discussion space for
>> those who build products or ship products with Sybase offerings.
>> This forum is not meant to be a replacement for or an alternative to
>> technical support, but has been established by Sybase as a means
>> of providing a vehicle for its customers and prospects to openly
>> and freely exchange information and ideas.
>> Please feel free to post questions and to post answers for any
>> questions where you may be of help.
>>
>> Please post and respond to questions in a professional, constructive
>> manner.
>> When posting a question, please wait 24 hours before reposting so that
>> users have a chance
>> to read the question.
>>
>> Welcome!
>>
>> Forum Purpose
>> --------------------
>>
>> This forum was established by Sybase as a means of providing a vehicle
>> for
>> its customers and prospects to openly and freely exchange information and
>> ideas. It is neither an alternative to, nor a replacement for a Customer
>> Support Contract.
>>
>> 1. This is NOT a Sybase technical support forum and it is not the
>> purpose
>> of this forum to allow customers to get free technical support from
>> Sybase.
>> It is a place for users to help each other and exchange problems
>> solutions,
>> information, ideas, etc.
>>
>> 2. Sybase has no obligation to provide questions, problems, or provide
>> anything other than a moderator to monitor the forum and insure its
>> operation and availability, exchange problems solutions, information,
>> ideas,
>> etc. They do strive, however, to do much more than that as resources
>> permit.
>>
>> 3. Sybase executives may monitor the forum to observe customer reaction
>> to
>> the product, keep up with users thoughts for new features, or offer
>> executive opinions and viewpoints. Sybase employees may also assist on
>> the
>> forum when they have time available. They will offer help but may not be
>> available on a regular basis based on their workload.
>>
>> 4. Sybase has selected a technically astute group of users to offer
>> assistance to other Sybase users. The name of this group is
>> TeamSybase. The moderator(s) of this forums is(are) member(s) of that
>> group. Generally, neither they nor the other members of TeamSybase are
>> Sybase employees, nor are they paid for their services in maintaining the
>> forum. And, while they may answer questions in the forum from time to
>> time,
>> they are not responsible for ensuring that all questions receive answers.
>>
>> Guidelines
>> --------------
>>
>> Please bear in mind that this is a moderated forum. As a result, it
>> operates somewhat differently than a typical unmoderated newsgroup.
>>
>> 1. If you're using a company id, please post your name at the end of the
>> message so that others may know who to address when sending an response.
>> We
>> would appreciate you using your full (real) name.
>>
>> 2. Please post the same question once in the forum that appears most
>> appropriate and allow 36-72 hours for a response.
>>
>> 3. Advertising of any kind should be limited to the forums dedicated to
>> that purpose (i.e., news.3rd_party_products, news.job_postings, etc.).
>> Spamming of the forum will not be tolerated.
>>
>> 4. Profanity, obscenities, and abuse of forum members will not be
>> tolerated.
>>
>> 5. Please refrain from sending "thanks" in the forum. Anyone desiring
>> to
>> thank the person assisting them should feel free to do so, but we would
>> ask
>> that this be done via e-mail to minimize traffic and allow members to
>> review
>> both problems and solutions.
>>
>> 6. Please refrain from sending personal messages in the forum. These
>> conversations are more properly carried on in e-mail.
>>
>> 7. This forum is not particularly designed for the transfer of files.
>> Therefore, if you need to make files accessible to other people, please
>> handle it through private email or by making the file available on an ftp
>> site or codexchange.sybase.com. Extremely large messages, particularly
>> those containing embedded files, will be deleted without notice.
>>
>> 8. Please put specifics on the message header(not "Help", "Bug",
>> "Urgent"
>> or vague subject headers). People often only review headers for messages
>> they are interested in. This is in your best interest in getting the
>> most
>> out of your message posting.
>>
>> 9. Please do not ask more than one question per message. If you have
>> five
>> questions, please post five messages. That way, duplication of answers
>> for
>> one problem and overlooked questions will be minimized.
>>
>> 10. When replying, ALWAYS include part of the message in your reply. Some
>> of
>> us CAN'T remember what happened five minutes ago, let alone yesterday.
>>
>> 11. The forum is primarily intended to assist Sybase end-users in
>> obtaining the maximum benefit from its products. It is not intended for
>> more
>> general discussions, such as features of various products, product
>> comparisons, etc. Please post messages of that type in more appropriate
>> arenas, such as an public, unmoderated newsgroup.
>>
>> John Strano
>> TeamSybase
>> Sybase Technology Evangelist
>>
>>
>
>


Ken Judkins Posted on 2008-01-31 18:07:48.0Z
From: "Ken Judkins" <nospam@nospam.com>
Newsgroups: sybase.public.commercial-isv.general
References: <479f1a94$1@forums-1-dub> <479f7476$1@forums-1-dub> <47a1ee25@forums-1-dub>
Subject: Re: Welcome
Lines: 221
X-Priority: 3
X-MSMail-Priority: Normal
X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.3138
X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3198
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NNTP-Posting-Host: vip152.sybase.com
X-Original-NNTP-Posting-Host: vip152.sybase.com
Message-ID: <47a20e74$1@forums-1-dub>
Date: 31 Jan 2008 10:07:48 -0800
X-Trace: forums-1-dub 1201802868 10.22.241.152 (31 Jan 2008 10:07:48 -0800)
X-Original-Trace: 31 Jan 2008 10:07:48 -0800, vip152.sybase.com
Path: forums-1-dub!not-for-mail
Xref: forums-1-dub sybase.public.commercial-isv.general:14
Article PK: 103736

John,

I'm writing the applications in PB9 to pay for the upgrade to PB11! I'm
cash only.

I have a day job, but I'd like to see if I can succeed with some side
projects. There are a billion potential customers on the Internet! I'll
get some programs written and marketed, and do all my learning and mistakes
using the tools I have. Since I don't "need" the money, I'll roll what I
get into new toys, the first of which will probably be PB11.

I say all that because I've been pushing for this newsgroup for a while, and
I want Sybase to know how valuable the knowledge I get here will be.

Ken

"John Strano[Sybase]" <nichtspamjstrano@csi.com> wrote in message
news:47a1ee25@forums-1-dub...
>>> John, you posed many of my questions in your original post! I'll split
>>> them into separate threads when I make my posts.
>
> <G> Yes, please.
>
>>> I have PowerBuilder 9 Enterprise. Once I am successfully selling a few
>>> products on a regular basis, I'd like to upgrade to PB 11.
>
> PowerBuilder 9 has been EOL for a while.
> I'd hate for you to have a time-sensitive issue to solve
> with a customer and not have us able to support you.
>
> --
> John Strano - Sybase Technology Evangelist
>
>
> "Ken Judkins" <nospam@nospam.com> wrote in message
> news:479f7476$1@forums-1-dub...
>> Thanks to Sybase for the Commercial-ISV newsgroup! I hope having a forum
>> outside the "technical details" areas will help people like me get a
>> product to market.
>>
>> I'd like to create applications I can sell over the Internet. I have
>> many questions because I have never done anything like that before.
>> Actually, John, you posed many of my questions in your original post!
>> I'll split them into separate threads when I make my posts.
>>
>> As I was thinking over the questions I have, I saw the benefit of this
>> newsgroup for Sybase. I have PowerBuilder 9 Enterprise. Once I am
>> successfully selling a few products on a regular basis, I'd like to
>> upgrade to PB 11. The advice and mentoring participants in this
>> newsgroup provide will be invaluable, and everybody will benefit.
>>
>> Ken Judkins
>>
>>
>>
>> "John Strano[Sybase]" <nichtspamjstrano@csi.com> wrote in message
>> news:479f1a94$1@forums-1-dub...
>>> Are you an ISV?
>>> Do you build commercial solutions using Sybase products?
>>>
>>> Have you ever wanted to regularly communicate with your peers in an open
>>> forum?
>>> Now you can.
>>>
>>> Possible topics about which you may want the
>>> opinion and experience of your peers...
>>>
>>> - Marketing Your Software: Internet Business Models
>>> - How do I design visually stunning applications?
>>> - Sources for Components, Services
>>> - "Automated Testing Tools I have Loved"
>>> - How to Create a Trial Version of Your Software
>>> - How to Enact a License in commercial applications
>>> - How to Certify Your Product for a specific OS
>>> - How Do I Limit My Fiduciary and Legal Culpability?
>>> - Disaster Recovery: How Much Redundancy is Enough?
>>> - Does SOA Yet Have a Place in a Commercial Solution?
>>> - How Can I Implement SaaS Into My Current Solutions?
>>>
>>> Here is the most likely place to find who solved the problem you're
>>> experiencing today...six months ago.
>>> The purpose of this newsgroup is to provide a discussion space for
>>> those who build products or ship products with Sybase offerings.
>>> This forum is not meant to be a replacement for or an alternative to
>>> technical support, but has been established by Sybase as a means
>>> of providing a vehicle for its customers and prospects to openly
>>> and freely exchange information and ideas.
>>> Please feel free to post questions and to post answers for any
>>> questions where you may be of help.
>>>
>>> Please post and respond to questions in a professional, constructive
>>> manner.
>>> When posting a question, please wait 24 hours before reposting so that
>>> users have a chance
>>> to read the question.
>>>
>>> Welcome!
>>>
>>> Forum Purpose
>>> --------------------
>>>
>>> This forum was established by Sybase as a means of providing a vehicle
>>> for
>>> its customers and prospects to openly and freely exchange information
>>> and
>>> ideas. It is neither an alternative to, nor a replacement for a
>>> Customer
>>> Support Contract.
>>>
>>> 1. This is NOT a Sybase technical support forum and it is not the
>>> purpose
>>> of this forum to allow customers to get free technical support from
>>> Sybase.
>>> It is a place for users to help each other and exchange problems
>>> solutions,
>>> information, ideas, etc.
>>>
>>> 2. Sybase has no obligation to provide questions, problems, or provide
>>> anything other than a moderator to monitor the forum and insure its
>>> operation and availability, exchange problems solutions, information,
>>> ideas,
>>> etc. They do strive, however, to do much more than that as resources
>>> permit.
>>>
>>> 3. Sybase executives may monitor the forum to observe customer reaction
>>> to
>>> the product, keep up with users thoughts for new features, or offer
>>> executive opinions and viewpoints. Sybase employees may also assist on
>>> the
>>> forum when they have time available. They will offer help but may not
>>> be
>>> available on a regular basis based on their workload.
>>>
>>> 4. Sybase has selected a technically astute group of users to offer
>>> assistance to other Sybase users. The name of this group is
>>> TeamSybase. The moderator(s) of this forums is(are) member(s) of that
>>> group. Generally, neither they nor the other members of TeamSybase are
>>> Sybase employees, nor are they paid for their services in maintaining
>>> the
>>> forum. And, while they may answer questions in the forum from time to
>>> time,
>>> they are not responsible for ensuring that all questions receive
>>> answers.
>>>
>>> Guidelines
>>> --------------
>>>
>>> Please bear in mind that this is a moderated forum. As a result, it
>>> operates somewhat differently than a typical unmoderated newsgroup.
>>>
>>> 1. If you're using a company id, please post your name at the end of
>>> the
>>> message so that others may know who to address when sending an response.
>>> We
>>> would appreciate you using your full (real) name.
>>>
>>> 2. Please post the same question once in the forum that appears most
>>> appropriate and allow 36-72 hours for a response.
>>>
>>> 3. Advertising of any kind should be limited to the forums dedicated to
>>> that purpose (i.e., news.3rd_party_products, news.job_postings, etc.).
>>> Spamming of the forum will not be tolerated.
>>>
>>> 4. Profanity, obscenities, and abuse of forum members will not be
>>> tolerated.
>>>
>>> 5. Please refrain from sending "thanks" in the forum. Anyone desiring
>>> to
>>> thank the person assisting them should feel free to do so, but we would
>>> ask
>>> that this be done via e-mail to minimize traffic and allow members to
>>> review
>>> both problems and solutions.
>>>
>>> 6. Please refrain from sending personal messages in the forum. These
>>> conversations are more properly carried on in e-mail.
>>>
>>> 7. This forum is not particularly designed for the transfer of files.
>>> Therefore, if you need to make files accessible to other people, please
>>> handle it through private email or by making the file available on an
>>> ftp
>>> site or codexchange.sybase.com. Extremely large messages, particularly
>>> those containing embedded files, will be deleted without notice.
>>>
>>> 8. Please put specifics on the message header(not "Help", "Bug",
>>> "Urgent"
>>> or vague subject headers). People often only review headers for messages
>>> they are interested in. This is in your best interest in getting the
>>> most
>>> out of your message posting.
>>>
>>> 9. Please do not ask more than one question per message. If you have
>>> five
>>> questions, please post five messages. That way, duplication of answers
>>> for
>>> one problem and overlooked questions will be minimized.
>>>
>>> 10. When replying, ALWAYS include part of the message in your reply.
>>> Some of
>>> us CAN'T remember what happened five minutes ago, let alone yesterday.
>>>
>>> 11. The forum is primarily intended to assist Sybase end-users in
>>> obtaining the maximum benefit from its products. It is not intended for
>>> more
>>> general discussions, such as features of various products, product
>>> comparisons, etc. Please post messages of that type in more appropriate
>>> arenas, such as an public, unmoderated newsgroup.
>>>
>>> John Strano
>>> TeamSybase
>>> Sybase Technology Evangelist
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>
>


John Strano[Sybase] Posted on 2008-01-31 18:48:45.0Z
From: "John Strano[Sybase]" <nichtspamjstrano@csi.com>
Newsgroups: sybase.public.commercial-isv.general
References: <479f1a94$1@forums-1-dub> <479f7476$1@forums-1-dub> <47a1ee25@forums-1-dub> <47a20e74$1@forums-1-dub>
Subject: Re: Welcome
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X-Trace: forums-1-dub 1201805325 10.22.241.152 (31 Jan 2008 10:48:45 -0800)
X-Original-Trace: 31 Jan 2008 10:48:45 -0800, vip152.sybase.com
X-Authenticated-User: TeamSybase
Path: forums-1-dub!not-for-mail
Xref: forums-1-dub sybase.public.commercial-isv.general:16
Article PK: 103738

>> I want Sybase to know how valuable the knowledge I get here will be.

]Great and thanks Ken. Noted.

--
John Strano - Sybase Technology Evangelist

"Ken Judkins" <nospam@nospam.com> wrote in message
news:47a20e74$1@forums-1-dub...
> John,
>
> I'm writing the applications in PB9 to pay for the upgrade to PB11! I'm
> cash only.
>
> I have a day job, but I'd like to see if I can succeed with some side
> projects. There are a billion potential customers on the Internet! I'll
> get some programs written and marketed, and do all my learning and
> mistakes using the tools I have. Since I don't "need" the money, I'll
> roll what I get into new toys, the first of which will probably be PB11.
>
> I say all that because I've been pushing for this newsgroup for a while,
> and I want Sybase to know how valuable the knowledge I get here will be.
>
> Ken
>
>
>
> "John Strano[Sybase]" <nichtspamjstrano@csi.com> wrote in message
> news:47a1ee25@forums-1-dub...
>>>> John, you posed many of my questions in your original post! I'll split
>>>> them into separate threads when I make my posts.
>>
>> <G> Yes, please.
>>
>>>> I have PowerBuilder 9 Enterprise. Once I am successfully selling a few
>>>> products on a regular basis, I'd like to upgrade to PB 11.
>>
>> PowerBuilder 9 has been EOL for a while.
>> I'd hate for you to have a time-sensitive issue to solve
>> with a customer and not have us able to support you.
>>
>> --
>> John Strano - Sybase Technology Evangelist
>>
>>
>> "Ken Judkins" <nospam@nospam.com> wrote in message
>> news:479f7476$1@forums-1-dub...
>>> Thanks to Sybase for the Commercial-ISV newsgroup! I hope having a
>>> forum outside the "technical details" areas will help people like me get
>>> a product to market.
>>>
>>> I'd like to create applications I can sell over the Internet. I have
>>> many questions because I have never done anything like that before.
>>> Actually, John, you posed many of my questions in your original post!
>>> I'll split them into separate threads when I make my posts.
>>>
>>> As I was thinking over the questions I have, I saw the benefit of this
>>> newsgroup for Sybase. I have PowerBuilder 9 Enterprise. Once I am
>>> successfully selling a few products on a regular basis, I'd like to
>>> upgrade to PB 11. The advice and mentoring participants in this
>>> newsgroup provide will be invaluable, and everybody will benefit.
>>>
>>> Ken Judkins
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> "John Strano[Sybase]" <nichtspamjstrano@csi.com> wrote in message
>>> news:479f1a94$1@forums-1-dub...
>>>> Are you an ISV?
>>>> Do you build commercial solutions using Sybase products?
>>>>
>>>> Have you ever wanted to regularly communicate with your peers in an
>>>> open forum?
>>>> Now you can.
>>>>
>>>> Possible topics about which you may want the
>>>> opinion and experience of your peers...
>>>>
>>>> - Marketing Your Software: Internet Business Models
>>>> - How do I design visually stunning applications?
>>>> - Sources for Components, Services
>>>> - "Automated Testing Tools I have Loved"
>>>> - How to Create a Trial Version of Your Software
>>>> - How to Enact a License in commercial applications
>>>> - How to Certify Your Product for a specific OS
>>>> - How Do I Limit My Fiduciary and Legal Culpability?
>>>> - Disaster Recovery: How Much Redundancy is Enough?
>>>> - Does SOA Yet Have a Place in a Commercial Solution?
>>>> - How Can I Implement SaaS Into My Current Solutions?
>>>>
>>>> Here is the most likely place to find who solved the problem you're
>>>> experiencing today...six months ago.
>>>> The purpose of this newsgroup is to provide a discussion space for
>>>> those who build products or ship products with Sybase offerings.
>>>> This forum is not meant to be a replacement for or an alternative to
>>>> technical support, but has been established by Sybase as a means
>>>> of providing a vehicle for its customers and prospects to openly
>>>> and freely exchange information and ideas.
>>>> Please feel free to post questions and to post answers for any
>>>> questions where you may be of help.
>>>>
>>>> Please post and respond to questions in a professional, constructive
>>>> manner.
>>>> When posting a question, please wait 24 hours before reposting so that
>>>> users have a chance
>>>> to read the question.
>>>>
>>>> Welcome!
>>>>
>>>> Forum Purpose
>>>> --------------------
>>>>
>>>> This forum was established by Sybase as a means of providing a vehicle
>>>> for
>>>> its customers and prospects to openly and freely exchange information
>>>> and
>>>> ideas. It is neither an alternative to, nor a replacement for a
>>>> Customer
>>>> Support Contract.
>>>>
>>>> 1. This is NOT a Sybase technical support forum and it is not the
>>>> purpose
>>>> of this forum to allow customers to get free technical support from
>>>> Sybase.
>>>> It is a place for users to help each other and exchange problems
>>>> solutions,
>>>> information, ideas, etc.
>>>>
>>>> 2. Sybase has no obligation to provide questions, problems, or provide
>>>> anything other than a moderator to monitor the forum and insure its
>>>> operation and availability, exchange problems solutions, information,
>>>> ideas,
>>>> etc. They do strive, however, to do much more than that as resources
>>>> permit.
>>>>
>>>> 3. Sybase executives may monitor the forum to observe customer
>>>> reaction to
>>>> the product, keep up with users thoughts for new features, or offer
>>>> executive opinions and viewpoints. Sybase employees may also assist on
>>>> the
>>>> forum when they have time available. They will offer help but may not
>>>> be
>>>> available on a regular basis based on their workload.
>>>>
>>>> 4. Sybase has selected a technically astute group of users to offer
>>>> assistance to other Sybase users. The name of this group is
>>>> TeamSybase. The moderator(s) of this forums is(are) member(s) of that
>>>> group. Generally, neither they nor the other members of TeamSybase are
>>>> Sybase employees, nor are they paid for their services in maintaining
>>>> the
>>>> forum. And, while they may answer questions in the forum from time to
>>>> time,
>>>> they are not responsible for ensuring that all questions receive
>>>> answers.
>>>>
>>>> Guidelines
>>>> --------------
>>>>
>>>> Please bear in mind that this is a moderated forum. As a result, it
>>>> operates somewhat differently than a typical unmoderated newsgroup.
>>>>
>>>> 1. If you're using a company id, please post your name at the end of
>>>> the
>>>> message so that others may know who to address when sending an
>>>> response. We
>>>> would appreciate you using your full (real) name.
>>>>
>>>> 2. Please post the same question once in the forum that appears most
>>>> appropriate and allow 36-72 hours for a response.
>>>>
>>>> 3. Advertising of any kind should be limited to the forums dedicated
>>>> to
>>>> that purpose (i.e., news.3rd_party_products, news.job_postings, etc.).
>>>> Spamming of the forum will not be tolerated.
>>>>
>>>> 4. Profanity, obscenities, and abuse of forum members will not be
>>>> tolerated.
>>>>
>>>> 5. Please refrain from sending "thanks" in the forum. Anyone desiring
>>>> to
>>>> thank the person assisting them should feel free to do so, but we would
>>>> ask
>>>> that this be done via e-mail to minimize traffic and allow members to
>>>> review
>>>> both problems and solutions.
>>>>
>>>> 6. Please refrain from sending personal messages in the forum. These
>>>> conversations are more properly carried on in e-mail.
>>>>
>>>> 7. This forum is not particularly designed for the transfer of files.
>>>> Therefore, if you need to make files accessible to other people, please
>>>> handle it through private email or by making the file available on an
>>>> ftp
>>>> site or codexchange.sybase.com. Extremely large messages, particularly
>>>> those containing embedded files, will be deleted without notice.
>>>>
>>>> 8. Please put specifics on the message header(not "Help", "Bug",
>>>> "Urgent"
>>>> or vague subject headers). People often only review headers for
>>>> messages
>>>> they are interested in. This is in your best interest in getting the
>>>> most
>>>> out of your message posting.
>>>>
>>>> 9. Please do not ask more than one question per message. If you have
>>>> five
>>>> questions, please post five messages. That way, duplication of answers
>>>> for
>>>> one problem and overlooked questions will be minimized.
>>>>
>>>> 10. When replying, ALWAYS include part of the message in your reply.
>>>> Some of
>>>> us CAN'T remember what happened five minutes ago, let alone yesterday.
>>>>
>>>> 11. The forum is primarily intended to assist Sybase end-users in
>>>> obtaining the maximum benefit from its products. It is not intended
>>>> for more
>>>> general discussions, such as features of various products, product
>>>> comparisons, etc. Please post messages of that type in more
>>>> appropriate
>>>> arenas, such as an public, unmoderated newsgroup.
>>>>
>>>> John Strano
>>>> TeamSybase
>>>> Sybase Technology Evangelist
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>
>


Jeff Gibson Posted on 2008-01-31 20:19:10.0Z
Reply-To: "Jeff Gibson" <jgibson@interceptsolutions.com>
From: "Jeff Gibson" <jgibson@interceptsolutions.com>
Newsgroups: sybase.public.commercial-isv.general
References: <479f1a94$1@forums-1-dub> <479f7476$1@forums-1-dub> <47a1ee25@forums-1-dub> <47a20e74$1@forums-1-dub>
Subject: Re: Welcome
Lines: 253
Organization: Intercept Solutions
X-Priority: 3
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Message-ID: <47a22d3e$1@forums-1-dub>
Date: 31 Jan 2008 12:19:10 -0800
X-Trace: forums-1-dub 1201810750 10.22.241.152 (31 Jan 2008 12:19:10 -0800)
X-Original-Trace: 31 Jan 2008 12:19:10 -0800, vip152.sybase.com
Path: forums-1-dub!not-for-mail
Xref: forums-1-dub sybase.public.commercial-isv.general:17
Article PK: 103739

I'm with you Ken.

I also have my main consulting gig, and have been working on a couple
commerical projects on the side. Basically just work early in the morning
or late in the evening (or middle of the night ;-) ). Have to spend my
own money for software and so forth, but it's nice that as I'm starting this
venture, I don't have one dime of debt.

The nice thing is that the individual I consult for wants me to integrate
some of my work into his business.

I think as this newsgroup grows, we will start to find a lot of other
individuals that are doing the same thing.

IMO, I don't think your going to have any issues running a PB9 app on Vista.
It may not have some of the interface elements that are the most current,
but you can also still run your application on a Windows 98 machine.

I hate to say it, but there are still machines out there running Windows 98.
Especially in my business area.

Jeff Gibson
Intercept Solutions - Sybase SQL Anywhere OEM Partner
Nashville, TN

"Ken Judkins" <nospam@nospam.com> wrote in message
news:47a20e74$1@forums-1-dub...
> John,
>
> I'm writing the applications in PB9 to pay for the upgrade to PB11! I'm
> cash only.
>
> I have a day job, but I'd like to see if I can succeed with some side
> projects. There are a billion potential customers on the Internet! I'll
> get some programs written and marketed, and do all my learning and
> mistakes using the tools I have. Since I don't "need" the money, I'll
> roll what I get into new toys, the first of which will probably be PB11.
>
> I say all that because I've been pushing for this newsgroup for a while,
> and I want Sybase to know how valuable the knowledge I get here will be.
>
> Ken
>
>
>
> "John Strano[Sybase]" <nichtspamjstrano@csi.com> wrote in message
> news:47a1ee25@forums-1-dub...
>>>> John, you posed many of my questions in your original post! I'll split
>>>> them into separate threads when I make my posts.
>>
>> <G> Yes, please.
>>
>>>> I have PowerBuilder 9 Enterprise. Once I am successfully selling a few
>>>> products on a regular basis, I'd like to upgrade to PB 11.
>>
>> PowerBuilder 9 has been EOL for a while.
>> I'd hate for you to have a time-sensitive issue to solve
>> with a customer and not have us able to support you.
>>
>> --
>> John Strano - Sybase Technology Evangelist
>>
>>
>> "Ken Judkins" <nospam@nospam.com> wrote in message
>> news:479f7476$1@forums-1-dub...
>>> Thanks to Sybase for the Commercial-ISV newsgroup! I hope having a
>>> forum outside the "technical details" areas will help people like me get
>>> a product to market.
>>>
>>> I'd like to create applications I can sell over the Internet. I have
>>> many questions because I have never done anything like that before.
>>> Actually, John, you posed many of my questions in your original post!
>>> I'll split them into separate threads when I make my posts.
>>>
>>> As I was thinking over the questions I have, I saw the benefit of this
>>> newsgroup for Sybase. I have PowerBuilder 9 Enterprise. Once I am
>>> successfully selling a few products on a regular basis, I'd like to
>>> upgrade to PB 11. The advice and mentoring participants in this
>>> newsgroup provide will be invaluable, and everybody will benefit.
>>>
>>> Ken Judkins
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> "John Strano[Sybase]" <nichtspamjstrano@csi.com> wrote in message
>>> news:479f1a94$1@forums-1-dub...
>>>> Are you an ISV?
>>>> Do you build commercial solutions using Sybase products?
>>>>
>>>> Have you ever wanted to regularly communicate with your peers in an
>>>> open forum?
>>>> Now you can.
>>>>
>>>> Possible topics about which you may want the
>>>> opinion and experience of your peers...
>>>>
>>>> - Marketing Your Software: Internet Business Models
>>>> - How do I design visually stunning applications?
>>>> - Sources for Components, Services
>>>> - "Automated Testing Tools I have Loved"
>>>> - How to Create a Trial Version of Your Software
>>>> - How to Enact a License in commercial applications
>>>> - How to Certify Your Product for a specific OS
>>>> - How Do I Limit My Fiduciary and Legal Culpability?
>>>> - Disaster Recovery: How Much Redundancy is Enough?
>>>> - Does SOA Yet Have a Place in a Commercial Solution?
>>>> - How Can I Implement SaaS Into My Current Solutions?
>>>>
>>>> Here is the most likely place to find who solved the problem you're
>>>> experiencing today...six months ago.
>>>> The purpose of this newsgroup is to provide a discussion space for
>>>> those who build products or ship products with Sybase offerings.
>>>> This forum is not meant to be a replacement for or an alternative to
>>>> technical support, but has been established by Sybase as a means
>>>> of providing a vehicle for its customers and prospects to openly
>>>> and freely exchange information and ideas.
>>>> Please feel free to post questions and to post answers for any
>>>> questions where you may be of help.
>>>>
>>>> Please post and respond to questions in a professional, constructive
>>>> manner.
>>>> When posting a question, please wait 24 hours before reposting so that
>>>> users have a chance
>>>> to read the question.
>>>>
>>>> Welcome!
>>>>
>>>> Forum Purpose
>>>> --------------------
>>>>
>>>> This forum was established by Sybase as a means of providing a vehicle
>>>> for
>>>> its customers and prospects to openly and freely exchange information
>>>> and
>>>> ideas. It is neither an alternative to, nor a replacement for a
>>>> Customer
>>>> Support Contract.
>>>>
>>>> 1. This is NOT a Sybase technical support forum and it is not the
>>>> purpose
>>>> of this forum to allow customers to get free technical support from
>>>> Sybase.
>>>> It is a place for users to help each other and exchange problems
>>>> solutions,
>>>> information, ideas, etc.
>>>>
>>>> 2. Sybase has no obligation to provide questions, problems, or provide
>>>> anything other than a moderator to monitor the forum and insure its
>>>> operation and availability, exchange problems solutions, information,
>>>> ideas,
>>>> etc. They do strive, however, to do much more than that as resources
>>>> permit.
>>>>
>>>> 3. Sybase executives may monitor the forum to observe customer
>>>> reaction to
>>>> the product, keep up with users thoughts for new features, or offer
>>>> executive opinions and viewpoints. Sybase employees may also assist on
>>>> the
>>>> forum when they have time available. They will offer help but may not
>>>> be
>>>> available on a regular basis based on their workload.
>>>>
>>>> 4. Sybase has selected a technically astute group of users to offer
>>>> assistance to other Sybase users. The name of this group is
>>>> TeamSybase. The moderator(s) of this forums is(are) member(s) of that
>>>> group. Generally, neither they nor the other members of TeamSybase are
>>>> Sybase employees, nor are they paid for their services in maintaining
>>>> the
>>>> forum. And, while they may answer questions in the forum from time to
>>>> time,
>>>> they are not responsible for ensuring that all questions receive
>>>> answers.
>>>>
>>>> Guidelines
>>>> --------------
>>>>
>>>> Please bear in mind that this is a moderated forum. As a result, it
>>>> operates somewhat differently than a typical unmoderated newsgroup.
>>>>
>>>> 1. If you're using a company id, please post your name at the end of
>>>> the
>>>> message so that others may know who to address when sending an
>>>> response. We
>>>> would appreciate you using your full (real) name.
>>>>
>>>> 2. Please post the same question once in the forum that appears most
>>>> appropriate and allow 36-72 hours for a response.
>>>>
>>>> 3. Advertising of any kind should be limited to the forums dedicated
>>>> to
>>>> that purpose (i.e., news.3rd_party_products, news.job_postings, etc.).
>>>> Spamming of the forum will not be tolerated.
>>>>
>>>> 4. Profanity, obscenities, and abuse of forum members will not be
>>>> tolerated.
>>>>
>>>> 5. Please refrain from sending "thanks" in the forum. Anyone desiring
>>>> to
>>>> thank the person assisting them should feel free to do so, but we would
>>>> ask
>>>> that this be done via e-mail to minimize traffic and allow members to
>>>> review
>>>> both problems and solutions.
>>>>
>>>> 6. Please refrain from sending personal messages in the forum. These
>>>> conversations are more properly carried on in e-mail.
>>>>
>>>> 7. This forum is not particularly designed for the transfer of files.
>>>> Therefore, if you need to make files accessible to other people, please
>>>> handle it through private email or by making the file available on an
>>>> ftp
>>>> site or codexchange.sybase.com. Extremely large messages, particularly
>>>> those containing embedded files, will be deleted without notice.
>>>>
>>>> 8. Please put specifics on the message header(not "Help", "Bug",
>>>> "Urgent"
>>>> or vague subject headers). People often only review headers for
>>>> messages
>>>> they are interested in. This is in your best interest in getting the
>>>> most
>>>> out of your message posting.
>>>>
>>>> 9. Please do not ask more than one question per message. If you have
>>>> five
>>>> questions, please post five messages. That way, duplication of answers
>>>> for
>>>> one problem and overlooked questions will be minimized.
>>>>
>>>> 10. When replying, ALWAYS include part of the message in your reply.
>>>> Some of
>>>> us CAN'T remember what happened five minutes ago, let alone yesterday.
>>>>
>>>> 11. The forum is primarily intended to assist Sybase end-users in
>>>> obtaining the maximum benefit from its products. It is not intended
>>>> for more
>>>> general discussions, such as features of various products, product
>>>> comparisons, etc. Please post messages of that type in more
>>>> appropriate
>>>> arenas, such as an public, unmoderated newsgroup.
>>>>
>>>> John Strano
>>>> TeamSybase
>>>> Sybase Technology Evangelist
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>
>


Richard Keller Posted on 2008-01-31 21:48:58.0Z
From: "Richard Keller" <richard@kellersystems.com>
Newsgroups: sybase.public.commercial-isv.general
References: <479f1a94$1@forums-1-dub> <479f7476$1@forums-1-dub> <47a1ee25@forums-1-dub> <47a20e74$1@forums-1-dub> <47a22d3e$1@forums-1-dub>
Subject: Re: Welcome
Lines: 269
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Date: 31 Jan 2008 13:48:58 -0800
X-Trace: forums-1-dub 1201816138 10.22.241.152 (31 Jan 2008 13:48:58 -0800)
X-Original-Trace: 31 Jan 2008 13:48:58 -0800, vip152.sybase.com
Path: forums-1-dub!not-for-mail
Xref: forums-1-dub sybase.public.commercial-isv.general:18
Article PK: 103740

You will absolutely have problems with PB9 on Vista, there are a number of
issues from Unicode to PB methods returning different values under Vista.
If you plan on supporting Vista you really need to upgrade.

Richard

"Jeff Gibson" <jgibson@interceptsolutions.com> wrote in message
news:47a22d3e$1@forums-1-dub...
> I'm with you Ken.
>
> I also have my main consulting gig, and have been working on a couple
> commerical projects on the side. Basically just work early in the morning
> or late in the evening (or middle of the night ;-) ). Have to spend my
> own money for software and so forth, but it's nice that as I'm starting
> this venture, I don't have one dime of debt.
>
> The nice thing is that the individual I consult for wants me to integrate
> some of my work into his business.
>
> I think as this newsgroup grows, we will start to find a lot of other
> individuals that are doing the same thing.
>
> IMO, I don't think your going to have any issues running a PB9 app on
> Vista. It may not have some of the interface elements that are the most
> current, but you can also still run your application on a Windows 98
> machine.
>
> I hate to say it, but there are still machines out there running Windows
> 98. Especially in my business area.
>
> Jeff Gibson
> Intercept Solutions - Sybase SQL Anywhere OEM Partner
> Nashville, TN
>
> "Ken Judkins" <nospam@nospam.com> wrote in message
> news:47a20e74$1@forums-1-dub...
>> John,
>>
>> I'm writing the applications in PB9 to pay for the upgrade to PB11! I'm
>> cash only.
>>
>> I have a day job, but I'd like to see if I can succeed with some side
>> projects. There are a billion potential customers on the Internet! I'll
>> get some programs written and marketed, and do all my learning and
>> mistakes using the tools I have. Since I don't "need" the money, I'll
>> roll what I get into new toys, the first of which will probably be PB11.
>>
>> I say all that because I've been pushing for this newsgroup for a while,
>> and I want Sybase to know how valuable the knowledge I get here will be.
>>
>> Ken
>>
>>
>>
>> "John Strano[Sybase]" <nichtspamjstrano@csi.com> wrote in message
>> news:47a1ee25@forums-1-dub...
>>>>> John, you posed many of my questions in your original post! I'll
>>>>> split them into separate threads when I make my posts.
>>>
>>> <G> Yes, please.
>>>
>>>>> I have PowerBuilder 9 Enterprise. Once I am successfully selling a
>>>>> few products on a regular basis, I'd like to upgrade to PB 11.
>>>
>>> PowerBuilder 9 has been EOL for a while.
>>> I'd hate for you to have a time-sensitive issue to solve
>>> with a customer and not have us able to support you.
>>>
>>> --
>>> John Strano - Sybase Technology Evangelist
>>>
>>>
>>> "Ken Judkins" <nospam@nospam.com> wrote in message
>>> news:479f7476$1@forums-1-dub...
>>>> Thanks to Sybase for the Commercial-ISV newsgroup! I hope having a
>>>> forum outside the "technical details" areas will help people like me
>>>> get a product to market.
>>>>
>>>> I'd like to create applications I can sell over the Internet. I have
>>>> many questions because I have never done anything like that before.
>>>> Actually, John, you posed many of my questions in your original post!
>>>> I'll split them into separate threads when I make my posts.
>>>>
>>>> As I was thinking over the questions I have, I saw the benefit of this
>>>> newsgroup for Sybase. I have PowerBuilder 9 Enterprise. Once I am
>>>> successfully selling a few products on a regular basis, I'd like to
>>>> upgrade to PB 11. The advice and mentoring participants in this
>>>> newsgroup provide will be invaluable, and everybody will benefit.
>>>>
>>>> Ken Judkins
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> "John Strano[Sybase]" <nichtspamjstrano@csi.com> wrote in message
>>>> news:479f1a94$1@forums-1-dub...
>>>>> Are you an ISV?
>>>>> Do you build commercial solutions using Sybase products?
>>>>>
>>>>> Have you ever wanted to regularly communicate with your peers in an
>>>>> open forum?
>>>>> Now you can.
>>>>>
>>>>> Possible topics about which you may want the
>>>>> opinion and experience of your peers...
>>>>>
>>>>> - Marketing Your Software: Internet Business Models
>>>>> - How do I design visually stunning applications?
>>>>> - Sources for Components, Services
>>>>> - "Automated Testing Tools I have Loved"
>>>>> - How to Create a Trial Version of Your Software
>>>>> - How to Enact a License in commercial applications
>>>>> - How to Certify Your Product for a specific OS
>>>>> - How Do I Limit My Fiduciary and Legal Culpability?
>>>>> - Disaster Recovery: How Much Redundancy is Enough?
>>>>> - Does SOA Yet Have a Place in a Commercial Solution?
>>>>> - How Can I Implement SaaS Into My Current Solutions?
>>>>>
>>>>> Here is the most likely place to find who solved the problem you're
>>>>> experiencing today...six months ago.
>>>>> The purpose of this newsgroup is to provide a discussion space for
>>>>> those who build products or ship products with Sybase offerings.
>>>>> This forum is not meant to be a replacement for or an alternative to
>>>>> technical support, but has been established by Sybase as a means
>>>>> of providing a vehicle for its customers and prospects to openly
>>>>> and freely exchange information and ideas.
>>>>> Please feel free to post questions and to post answers for any
>>>>> questions where you may be of help.
>>>>>
>>>>> Please post and respond to questions in a professional, constructive
>>>>> manner.
>>>>> When posting a question, please wait 24 hours before reposting so that
>>>>> users have a chance
>>>>> to read the question.
>>>>>
>>>>> Welcome!
>>>>>
>>>>> Forum Purpose
>>>>> --------------------
>>>>>
>>>>> This forum was established by Sybase as a means of providing a vehicle
>>>>> for
>>>>> its customers and prospects to openly and freely exchange information
>>>>> and
>>>>> ideas. It is neither an alternative to, nor a replacement for a
>>>>> Customer
>>>>> Support Contract.
>>>>>
>>>>> 1. This is NOT a Sybase technical support forum and it is not the
>>>>> purpose
>>>>> of this forum to allow customers to get free technical support from
>>>>> Sybase.
>>>>> It is a place for users to help each other and exchange problems
>>>>> solutions,
>>>>> information, ideas, etc.
>>>>>
>>>>> 2. Sybase has no obligation to provide questions, problems, or
>>>>> provide
>>>>> anything other than a moderator to monitor the forum and insure its
>>>>> operation and availability, exchange problems solutions, information,
>>>>> ideas,
>>>>> etc. They do strive, however, to do much more than that as resources
>>>>> permit.
>>>>>
>>>>> 3. Sybase executives may monitor the forum to observe customer
>>>>> reaction to
>>>>> the product, keep up with users thoughts for new features, or offer
>>>>> executive opinions and viewpoints. Sybase employees may also assist
>>>>> on the
>>>>> forum when they have time available. They will offer help but may not
>>>>> be
>>>>> available on a regular basis based on their workload.
>>>>>
>>>>> 4. Sybase has selected a technically astute group of users to offer
>>>>> assistance to other Sybase users. The name of this group is
>>>>> TeamSybase. The moderator(s) of this forums is(are) member(s) of that
>>>>> group. Generally, neither they nor the other members of TeamSybase
>>>>> are
>>>>> Sybase employees, nor are they paid for their services in maintaining
>>>>> the
>>>>> forum. And, while they may answer questions in the forum from time to
>>>>> time,
>>>>> they are not responsible for ensuring that all questions receive
>>>>> answers.
>>>>>
>>>>> Guidelines
>>>>> --------------
>>>>>
>>>>> Please bear in mind that this is a moderated forum. As a result, it
>>>>> operates somewhat differently than a typical unmoderated newsgroup.
>>>>>
>>>>> 1. If you're using a company id, please post your name at the end of
>>>>> the
>>>>> message so that others may know who to address when sending an
>>>>> response. We
>>>>> would appreciate you using your full (real) name.
>>>>>
>>>>> 2. Please post the same question once in the forum that appears most
>>>>> appropriate and allow 36-72 hours for a response.
>>>>>
>>>>> 3. Advertising of any kind should be limited to the forums dedicated
>>>>> to
>>>>> that purpose (i.e., news.3rd_party_products, news.job_postings,
>>>>> etc.).
>>>>> Spamming of the forum will not be tolerated.
>>>>>
>>>>> 4. Profanity, obscenities, and abuse of forum members will not be
>>>>> tolerated.
>>>>>
>>>>> 5. Please refrain from sending "thanks" in the forum. Anyone
>>>>> desiring to
>>>>> thank the person assisting them should feel free to do so, but we
>>>>> would ask
>>>>> that this be done via e-mail to minimize traffic and allow members to
>>>>> review
>>>>> both problems and solutions.
>>>>>
>>>>> 6. Please refrain from sending personal messages in the forum. These
>>>>> conversations are more properly carried on in e-mail.
>>>>>
>>>>> 7. This forum is not particularly designed for the transfer of files.
>>>>> Therefore, if you need to make files accessible to other people,
>>>>> please
>>>>> handle it through private email or by making the file available on an
>>>>> ftp
>>>>> site or codexchange.sybase.com. Extremely large messages,
>>>>> particularly
>>>>> those containing embedded files, will be deleted without notice.
>>>>>
>>>>> 8. Please put specifics on the message header(not "Help", "Bug",
>>>>> "Urgent"
>>>>> or vague subject headers). People often only review headers for
>>>>> messages
>>>>> they are interested in. This is in your best interest in getting the
>>>>> most
>>>>> out of your message posting.
>>>>>
>>>>> 9. Please do not ask more than one question per message. If you have
>>>>> five
>>>>> questions, please post five messages. That way, duplication of
>>>>> answers for
>>>>> one problem and overlooked questions will be minimized.
>>>>>
>>>>> 10. When replying, ALWAYS include part of the message in your reply.
>>>>> Some of
>>>>> us CAN'T remember what happened five minutes ago, let alone yesterday.
>>>>>
>>>>> 11. The forum is primarily intended to assist Sybase end-users in
>>>>> obtaining the maximum benefit from its products. It is not intended
>>>>> for more
>>>>> general discussions, such as features of various products, product
>>>>> comparisons, etc. Please post messages of that type in more
>>>>> appropriate
>>>>> arenas, such as an public, unmoderated newsgroup.
>>>>>
>>>>> John Strano
>>>>> TeamSybase
>>>>> Sybase Technology Evangelist
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>
>


Jeff Gibson Posted on 2008-01-31 22:37:13.0Z
Reply-To: "Jeff Gibson" <jgibson@interceptsolutions.com>
From: "Jeff Gibson" <jgibson@interceptsolutions.com>
Newsgroups: sybase.public.commercial-isv.general
References: <479f1a94$1@forums-1-dub> <479f7476$1@forums-1-dub> <47a1ee25@forums-1-dub> <47a20e74$1@forums-1-dub> <47a22d3e$1@forums-1-dub> <47a2424a$1@forums-1-dub>
Subject: Re: Welcome
Lines: 290
Organization: Intercept Solutions
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Message-ID: <47a24d99@forums-1-dub>
Date: 31 Jan 2008 14:37:13 -0800
X-Trace: forums-1-dub 1201819033 10.22.241.152 (31 Jan 2008 14:37:13 -0800)
X-Original-Trace: 31 Jan 2008 14:37:13 -0800, vip152.sybase.com
Path: forums-1-dub!not-for-mail
Xref: forums-1-dub sybase.public.commercial-isv.general:19
Article PK: 103741

Good point Richard.

Can you tell me what type of functions are affected? Are we talking about
string functions, arrays not working, anything you can be specific on???

Probably a good idea to test your application out before deploying it. ;-)

Thanks for the heads up Richard.

Jeff Gibson
Intercept Solutions - Sybase SQL Anywhere OEM Partner
Nashville, TN

"Richard Keller" <richard@kellersystems.com> wrote in message
news:47a2424a$1@forums-1-dub...
> You will absolutely have problems with PB9 on Vista, there are a number
> of issues from Unicode to PB methods returning different values under
> Vista. If you plan on supporting Vista you really need to upgrade.
>
> Richard
>
> "Jeff Gibson" <jgibson@interceptsolutions.com> wrote in message
> news:47a22d3e$1@forums-1-dub...
>> I'm with you Ken.
>>
>> I also have my main consulting gig, and have been working on a couple
>> commerical projects on the side. Basically just work early in the
>> morning or late in the evening (or middle of the night ;-) ). Have to
>> spend my own money for software and so forth, but it's nice that as I'm
>> starting this venture, I don't have one dime of debt.
>>
>> The nice thing is that the individual I consult for wants me to integrate
>> some of my work into his business.
>>
>> I think as this newsgroup grows, we will start to find a lot of other
>> individuals that are doing the same thing.
>>
>> IMO, I don't think your going to have any issues running a PB9 app on
>> Vista. It may not have some of the interface elements that are the most
>> current, but you can also still run your application on a Windows 98
>> machine.
>>
>> I hate to say it, but there are still machines out there running Windows
>> 98. Especially in my business area.
>>
>> Jeff Gibson
>> Intercept Solutions - Sybase SQL Anywhere OEM Partner
>> Nashville, TN
>>
>> "Ken Judkins" <nospam@nospam.com> wrote in message
>> news:47a20e74$1@forums-1-dub...
>>> John,
>>>
>>> I'm writing the applications in PB9 to pay for the upgrade to PB11! I'm
>>> cash only.
>>>
>>> I have a day job, but I'd like to see if I can succeed with some side
>>> projects. There are a billion potential customers on the Internet!
>>> I'll get some programs written and marketed, and do all my learning and
>>> mistakes using the tools I have. Since I don't "need" the money, I'll
>>> roll what I get into new toys, the first of which will probably be PB11.
>>>
>>> I say all that because I've been pushing for this newsgroup for a while,
>>> and I want Sybase to know how valuable the knowledge I get here will be.
>>>
>>> Ken
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> "John Strano[Sybase]" <nichtspamjstrano@csi.com> wrote in message
>>> news:47a1ee25@forums-1-dub...
>>>>>> John, you posed many of my questions in your original post! I'll
>>>>>> split them into separate threads when I make my posts.
>>>>
>>>> <G> Yes, please.
>>>>
>>>>>> I have PowerBuilder 9 Enterprise. Once I am successfully selling a
>>>>>> few products on a regular basis, I'd like to upgrade to PB 11.
>>>>
>>>> PowerBuilder 9 has been EOL for a while.
>>>> I'd hate for you to have a time-sensitive issue to solve
>>>> with a customer and not have us able to support you.
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>> John Strano - Sybase Technology Evangelist
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> "Ken Judkins" <nospam@nospam.com> wrote in message
>>>> news:479f7476$1@forums-1-dub...
>>>>> Thanks to Sybase for the Commercial-ISV newsgroup! I hope having a
>>>>> forum outside the "technical details" areas will help people like me
>>>>> get a product to market.
>>>>>
>>>>> I'd like to create applications I can sell over the Internet. I have
>>>>> many questions because I have never done anything like that before.
>>>>> Actually, John, you posed many of my questions in your original post!
>>>>> I'll split them into separate threads when I make my posts.
>>>>>
>>>>> As I was thinking over the questions I have, I saw the benefit of this
>>>>> newsgroup for Sybase. I have PowerBuilder 9 Enterprise. Once I am
>>>>> successfully selling a few products on a regular basis, I'd like to
>>>>> upgrade to PB 11. The advice and mentoring participants in this
>>>>> newsgroup provide will be invaluable, and everybody will benefit.
>>>>>
>>>>> Ken Judkins
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> "John Strano[Sybase]" <nichtspamjstrano@csi.com> wrote in message
>>>>> news:479f1a94$1@forums-1-dub...
>>>>>> Are you an ISV?
>>>>>> Do you build commercial solutions using Sybase products?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Have you ever wanted to regularly communicate with your peers in an
>>>>>> open forum?
>>>>>> Now you can.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Possible topics about which you may want the
>>>>>> opinion and experience of your peers...
>>>>>>
>>>>>> - Marketing Your Software: Internet Business Models
>>>>>> - How do I design visually stunning applications?
>>>>>> - Sources for Components, Services
>>>>>> - "Automated Testing Tools I have Loved"
>>>>>> - How to Create a Trial Version of Your Software
>>>>>> - How to Enact a License in commercial applications
>>>>>> - How to Certify Your Product for a specific OS
>>>>>> - How Do I Limit My Fiduciary and Legal Culpability?
>>>>>> - Disaster Recovery: How Much Redundancy is Enough?
>>>>>> - Does SOA Yet Have a Place in a Commercial Solution?
>>>>>> - How Can I Implement SaaS Into My Current Solutions?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Here is the most likely place to find who solved the problem you're
>>>>>> experiencing today...six months ago.
>>>>>> The purpose of this newsgroup is to provide a discussion space for
>>>>>> those who build products or ship products with Sybase offerings.
>>>>>> This forum is not meant to be a replacement for or an alternative to
>>>>>> technical support, but has been established by Sybase as a means
>>>>>> of providing a vehicle for its customers and prospects to openly
>>>>>> and freely exchange information and ideas.
>>>>>> Please feel free to post questions and to post answers for any
>>>>>> questions where you may be of help.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Please post and respond to questions in a professional, constructive
>>>>>> manner.
>>>>>> When posting a question, please wait 24 hours before reposting so
>>>>>> that users have a chance
>>>>>> to read the question.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Welcome!
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Forum Purpose
>>>>>> --------------------
>>>>>>
>>>>>> This forum was established by Sybase as a means of providing a
>>>>>> vehicle for
>>>>>> its customers and prospects to openly and freely exchange information
>>>>>> and
>>>>>> ideas. It is neither an alternative to, nor a replacement for a
>>>>>> Customer
>>>>>> Support Contract.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> 1. This is NOT a Sybase technical support forum and it is not the
>>>>>> purpose
>>>>>> of this forum to allow customers to get free technical support from
>>>>>> Sybase.
>>>>>> It is a place for users to help each other and exchange problems
>>>>>> solutions,
>>>>>> information, ideas, etc.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> 2. Sybase has no obligation to provide questions, problems, or
>>>>>> provide
>>>>>> anything other than a moderator to monitor the forum and insure its
>>>>>> operation and availability, exchange problems solutions, information,
>>>>>> ideas,
>>>>>> etc. They do strive, however, to do much more than that as resources
>>>>>> permit.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> 3. Sybase executives may monitor the forum to observe customer
>>>>>> reaction to
>>>>>> the product, keep up with users thoughts for new features, or offer
>>>>>> executive opinions and viewpoints. Sybase employees may also assist
>>>>>> on the
>>>>>> forum when they have time available. They will offer help but may
>>>>>> not be
>>>>>> available on a regular basis based on their workload.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> 4. Sybase has selected a technically astute group of users to offer
>>>>>> assistance to other Sybase users. The name of this group is
>>>>>> TeamSybase. The moderator(s) of this forums is(are) member(s) of
>>>>>> that
>>>>>> group. Generally, neither they nor the other members of TeamSybase
>>>>>> are
>>>>>> Sybase employees, nor are they paid for their services in maintaining
>>>>>> the
>>>>>> forum. And, while they may answer questions in the forum from time
>>>>>> to time,
>>>>>> they are not responsible for ensuring that all questions receive
>>>>>> answers.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Guidelines
>>>>>> --------------
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Please bear in mind that this is a moderated forum. As a result, it
>>>>>> operates somewhat differently than a typical unmoderated newsgroup.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> 1. If you're using a company id, please post your name at the end of
>>>>>> the
>>>>>> message so that others may know who to address when sending an
>>>>>> response. We
>>>>>> would appreciate you using your full (real) name.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> 2. Please post the same question once in the forum that appears most
>>>>>> appropriate and allow 36-72 hours for a response.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> 3. Advertising of any kind should be limited to the forums dedicated
>>>>>> to
>>>>>> that purpose (i.e., news.3rd_party_products, news.job_postings,
>>>>>> etc.).
>>>>>> Spamming of the forum will not be tolerated.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> 4. Profanity, obscenities, and abuse of forum members will not be
>>>>>> tolerated.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> 5. Please refrain from sending "thanks" in the forum. Anyone
>>>>>> desiring to
>>>>>> thank the person assisting them should feel free to do so, but we
>>>>>> would ask
>>>>>> that this be done via e-mail to minimize traffic and allow members to
>>>>>> review
>>>>>> both problems and solutions.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> 6. Please refrain from sending personal messages in the forum.
>>>>>> These
>>>>>> conversations are more properly carried on in e-mail.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> 7. This forum is not particularly designed for the transfer of
>>>>>> files.
>>>>>> Therefore, if you need to make files accessible to other people,
>>>>>> please
>>>>>> handle it through private email or by making the file available on an
>>>>>> ftp
>>>>>> site or codexchange.sybase.com. Extremely large messages,
>>>>>> particularly
>>>>>> those containing embedded files, will be deleted without notice.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> 8. Please put specifics on the message header(not "Help", "Bug",
>>>>>> "Urgent"
>>>>>> or vague subject headers). People often only review headers for
>>>>>> messages
>>>>>> they are interested in. This is in your best interest in getting the
>>>>>> most
>>>>>> out of your message posting.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> 9. Please do not ask more than one question per message. If you
>>>>>> have five
>>>>>> questions, please post five messages. That way, duplication of
>>>>>> answers for
>>>>>> one problem and overlooked questions will be minimized.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> 10. When replying, ALWAYS include part of the message in your reply.
>>>>>> Some of
>>>>>> us CAN'T remember what happened five minutes ago, let alone
>>>>>> yesterday.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> 11. The forum is primarily intended to assist Sybase end-users in
>>>>>> obtaining the maximum benefit from its products. It is not intended
>>>>>> for more
>>>>>> general discussions, such as features of various products, product
>>>>>> comparisons, etc. Please post messages of that type in more
>>>>>> appropriate
>>>>>> arenas, such as an public, unmoderated newsgroup.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> John Strano
>>>>>> TeamSybase
>>>>>> Sybase Technology Evangelist
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>
>


Randy Posted on 2008-02-04 19:02:21.0Z
From: "Randy" <cgreenwellNOSPAMPlease@sparusa.com>
Newsgroups: sybase.public.commercial-isv.general
References: <479f1a94$1@forums-1-dub> <479f7476$1@forums-1-dub> <47a1ee25@forums-1-dub> <47a20e74$1@forums-1-dub>
Subject: Re: Welcome
Lines: 236
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X-Original-NNTP-Posting-Host: vip152.sybase.com
Message-ID: <47a7613d@forums-1-dub>
Date: 4 Feb 2008 11:02:21 -0800
X-Trace: forums-1-dub 1202151741 10.22.241.152 (4 Feb 2008 11:02:21 -0800)
X-Original-Trace: 4 Feb 2008 11:02:21 -0800, vip152.sybase.com
X-Authenticated-User: pb110beta
Path: forums-1-dub!not-for-mail
Xref: forums-1-dub sybase.public.commercial-isv.general:36
Article PK: 103759

Not to push ISUG, but you do get a bunch of nice stuff for free and some at
a discount. For example, you can get a copy of PB11 for free. Well, not
exactly free...but close.

http://www.isug.com/common/GoldBenefits.html

Randy

"Ken Judkins" <nospam@nospam.com> wrote in message
news:47a20e74$1@forums-1-dub...
> John,
>
> I'm writing the applications in PB9 to pay for the upgrade to PB11! I'm
> cash only.
>
> I have a day job, but I'd like to see if I can succeed with some side
> projects. There are a billion potential customers on the Internet! I'll
> get some programs written and marketed, and do all my learning and
> mistakes using the tools I have. Since I don't "need" the money, I'll
> roll what I get into new toys, the first of which will probably be PB11.
>
> I say all that because I've been pushing for this newsgroup for a while,
> and I want Sybase to know how valuable the knowledge I get here will be.
>
> Ken
>
>
>
> "John Strano[Sybase]" <nichtspamjstrano@csi.com> wrote in message
> news:47a1ee25@forums-1-dub...
>>>> John, you posed many of my questions in your original post! I'll split
>>>> them into separate threads when I make my posts.
>>
>> <G> Yes, please.
>>
>>>> I have PowerBuilder 9 Enterprise. Once I am successfully selling a few
>>>> products on a regular basis, I'd like to upgrade to PB 11.
>>
>> PowerBuilder 9 has been EOL for a while.
>> I'd hate for you to have a time-sensitive issue to solve
>> with a customer and not have us able to support you.
>>
>> --
>> John Strano - Sybase Technology Evangelist
>>
>>
>> "Ken Judkins" <nospam@nospam.com> wrote in message
>> news:479f7476$1@forums-1-dub...
>>> Thanks to Sybase for the Commercial-ISV newsgroup! I hope having a
>>> forum outside the "technical details" areas will help people like me get
>>> a product to market.
>>>
>>> I'd like to create applications I can sell over the Internet. I have
>>> many questions because I have never done anything like that before.
>>> Actually, John, you posed many of my questions in your original post!
>>> I'll split them into separate threads when I make my posts.
>>>
>>> As I was thinking over the questions I have, I saw the benefit of this
>>> newsgroup for Sybase. I have PowerBuilder 9 Enterprise. Once I am
>>> successfully selling a few products on a regular basis, I'd like to
>>> upgrade to PB 11. The advice and mentoring participants in this
>>> newsgroup provide will be invaluable, and everybody will benefit.
>>>
>>> Ken Judkins
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> "John Strano[Sybase]" <nichtspamjstrano@csi.com> wrote in message
>>> news:479f1a94$1@forums-1-dub...
>>>> Are you an ISV?
>>>> Do you build commercial solutions using Sybase products?
>>>>
>>>> Have you ever wanted to regularly communicate with your peers in an
>>>> open forum?
>>>> Now you can.
>>>>
>>>> Possible topics about which you may want the
>>>> opinion and experience of your peers...
>>>>
>>>> - Marketing Your Software: Internet Business Models
>>>> - How do I design visually stunning applications?
>>>> - Sources for Components, Services
>>>> - "Automated Testing Tools I have Loved"
>>>> - How to Create a Trial Version of Your Software
>>>> - How to Enact a License in commercial applications
>>>> - How to Certify Your Product for a specific OS
>>>> - How Do I Limit My Fiduciary and Legal Culpability?
>>>> - Disaster Recovery: How Much Redundancy is Enough?
>>>> - Does SOA Yet Have a Place in a Commercial Solution?
>>>> - How Can I Implement SaaS Into My Current Solutions?
>>>>
>>>> Here is the most likely place to find who solved the problem you're
>>>> experiencing today...six months ago.
>>>> The purpose of this newsgroup is to provide a discussion space for
>>>> those who build products or ship products with Sybase offerings.
>>>> This forum is not meant to be a replacement for or an alternative to
>>>> technical support, but has been established by Sybase as a means
>>>> of providing a vehicle for its customers and prospects to openly
>>>> and freely exchange information and ideas.
>>>> Please feel free to post questions and to post answers for any
>>>> questions where you may be of help.
>>>>
>>>> Please post and respond to questions in a professional, constructive
>>>> manner.
>>>> When posting a question, please wait 24 hours before reposting so that
>>>> users have a chance
>>>> to read the question.
>>>>
>>>> Welcome!
>>>>
>>>> Forum Purpose
>>>> --------------------
>>>>
>>>> This forum was established by Sybase as a means of providing a vehicle
>>>> for
>>>> its customers and prospects to openly and freely exchange information
>>>> and
>>>> ideas. It is neither an alternative to, nor a replacement for a
>>>> Customer
>>>> Support Contract.
>>>>
>>>> 1. This is NOT a Sybase technical support forum and it is not the
>>>> purpose
>>>> of this forum to allow customers to get free technical support from
>>>> Sybase.
>>>> It is a place for users to help each other and exchange problems
>>>> solutions,
>>>> information, ideas, etc.
>>>>
>>>> 2. Sybase has no obligation to provide questions, problems, or provide
>>>> anything other than a moderator to monitor the forum and insure its
>>>> operation and availability, exchange problems solutions, information,
>>>> ideas,
>>>> etc. They do strive, however, to do much more than that as resources
>>>> permit.
>>>>
>>>> 3. Sybase executives may monitor the forum to observe customer
>>>> reaction to
>>>> the product, keep up with users thoughts for new features, or offer
>>>> executive opinions and viewpoints. Sybase employees may also assist on
>>>> the
>>>> forum when they have time available. They will offer help but may not
>>>> be
>>>> available on a regular basis based on their workload.
>>>>
>>>> 4. Sybase has selected a technically astute group of users to offer
>>>> assistance to other Sybase users. The name of this group is
>>>> TeamSybase. The moderator(s) of this forums is(are) member(s) of that
>>>> group. Generally, neither they nor the other members of TeamSybase are
>>>> Sybase employees, nor are they paid for their services in maintaining
>>>> the
>>>> forum. And, while they may answer questions in the forum from time to
>>>> time,
>>>> they are not responsible for ensuring that all questions receive
>>>> answers.
>>>>
>>>> Guidelines
>>>> --------------
>>>>
>>>> Please bear in mind that this is a moderated forum. As a result, it
>>>> operates somewhat differently than a typical unmoderated newsgroup.
>>>>
>>>> 1. If you're using a company id, please post your name at the end of
>>>> the
>>>> message so that others may know who to address when sending an
>>>> response. We
>>>> would appreciate you using your full (real) name.
>>>>
>>>> 2. Please post the same question once in the forum that appears most
>>>> appropriate and allow 36-72 hours for a response.
>>>>
>>>> 3. Advertising of any kind should be limited to the forums dedicated
>>>> to
>>>> that purpose (i.e., news.3rd_party_products, news.job_postings, etc.).
>>>> Spamming of the forum will not be tolerated.
>>>>
>>>> 4. Profanity, obscenities, and abuse of forum members will not be
>>>> tolerated.
>>>>
>>>> 5. Please refrain from sending "thanks" in the forum. Anyone desiring
>>>> to
>>>> thank the person assisting them should feel free to do so, but we would
>>>> ask
>>>> that this be done via e-mail to minimize traffic and allow members to
>>>> review
>>>> both problems and solutions.
>>>>
>>>> 6. Please refrain from sending personal messages in the forum. These
>>>> conversations are more properly carried on in e-mail.
>>>>
>>>> 7. This forum is not particularly designed for the transfer of files.
>>>> Therefore, if you need to make files accessible to other people, please
>>>> handle it through private email or by making the file available on an
>>>> ftp
>>>> site or codexchange.sybase.com. Extremely large messages, particularly
>>>> those containing embedded files, will be deleted without notice.
>>>>
>>>> 8. Please put specifics on the message header(not "Help", "Bug",
>>>> "Urgent"
>>>> or vague subject headers). People often only review headers for
>>>> messages
>>>> they are interested in. This is in your best interest in getting the
>>>> most
>>>> out of your message posting.
>>>>
>>>> 9. Please do not ask more than one question per message. If you have
>>>> five
>>>> questions, please post five messages. That way, duplication of answers
>>>> for
>>>> one problem and overlooked questions will be minimized.
>>>>
>>>> 10. When replying, ALWAYS include part of the message in your reply.
>>>> Some of
>>>> us CAN'T remember what happened five minutes ago, let alone yesterday.
>>>>
>>>> 11. The forum is primarily intended to assist Sybase end-users in
>>>> obtaining the maximum benefit from its products. It is not intended
>>>> for more
>>>> general discussions, such as features of various products, product
>>>> comparisons, etc. Please post messages of that type in more
>>>> appropriate
>>>> arenas, such as an public, unmoderated newsgroup.
>>>>
>>>> John Strano
>>>> TeamSybase
>>>> Sybase Technology Evangelist
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>
>


Ken Judkins Posted on 2008-02-05 18:21:54.0Z
From: "Ken Judkins" <nospam@nospam.com>
Newsgroups: sybase.public.commercial-isv.general
References: <479f1a94$1@forums-1-dub> <479f7476$1@forums-1-dub> <47a1ee25@forums-1-dub> <47a20e74$1@forums-1-dub> <47a7613d@forums-1-dub>
Subject: Re: Welcome
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Path: forums-1-dub!not-for-mail
Xref: forums-1-dub sybase.public.commercial-isv.general:41
Article PK: 103763

Randy,

I am already a Gold member of ISUG. I have the NFR PB11. However, it is a
Not For Resale version, so you are not allowed to do anything more than
learn on it. If I used that for profit, black helicopters with the
PowerBuilder Police would swarm all over my house within minutes!

Ken

"Randy" <cgreenwellNOSPAMPlease@sparusa.com> wrote in message
news:47a7613d@forums-1-dub...
> Not to push ISUG, but you do get a bunch of nice stuff for free and some
> at a discount. For example, you can get a copy of PB11 for free. Well,
> not exactly free...but close.
>
> http://www.isug.com/common/GoldBenefits.html
>
> Randy
>
> "Ken Judkins" <nospam@nospam.com> wrote in message
> news:47a20e74$1@forums-1-dub...
>> John,
>>
>> I'm writing the applications in PB9 to pay for the upgrade to PB11! I'm
>> cash only.
>>
>> I have a day job, but I'd like to see if I can succeed with some side
>> projects. There are a billion potential customers on the Internet! I'll
>> get some programs written and marketed, and do all my learning and
>> mistakes using the tools I have. Since I don't "need" the money, I'll
>> roll what I get into new toys, the first of which will probably be PB11.
>>
>> I say all that because I've been pushing for this newsgroup for a while,
>> and I want Sybase to know how valuable the knowledge I get here will be.
>>
>> Ken
>>
>>
>>
>> "John Strano[Sybase]" <nichtspamjstrano@csi.com> wrote in message
>> news:47a1ee25@forums-1-dub...
>>>>> John, you posed many of my questions in your original post! I'll
>>>>> split them into separate threads when I make my posts.
>>>
>>> <G> Yes, please.
>>>
>>>>> I have PowerBuilder 9 Enterprise. Once I am successfully selling a
>>>>> few products on a regular basis, I'd like to upgrade to PB 11.
>>>
>>> PowerBuilder 9 has been EOL for a while.
>>> I'd hate for you to have a time-sensitive issue to solve
>>> with a customer and not have us able to support you.
>>>
>>> --
>>> John Strano - Sybase Technology Evangelist
>>>
>>>
>>> "Ken Judkins" <nospam@nospam.com> wrote in message
>>> news:479f7476$1@forums-1-dub...
>>>> Thanks to Sybase for the Commercial-ISV newsgroup! I hope having a
>>>> forum outside the "technical details" areas will help people like me
>>>> get a product to market.
>>>>
>>>> I'd like to create applications I can sell over the Internet. I have
>>>> many questions because I have never done anything like that before.
>>>> Actually, John, you posed many of my questions in your original post!
>>>> I'll split them into separate threads when I make my posts.
>>>>
>>>> As I was thinking over the questions I have, I saw the benefit of this
>>>> newsgroup for Sybase. I have PowerBuilder 9 Enterprise. Once I am
>>>> successfully selling a few products on a regular basis, I'd like to
>>>> upgrade to PB 11. The advice and mentoring participants in this
>>>> newsgroup provide will be invaluable, and everybody will benefit.
>>>>
>>>> Ken Judkins
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> "John Strano[Sybase]" <nichtspamjstrano@csi.com> wrote in message
>>>> news:479f1a94$1@forums-1-dub...
>>>>> Are you an ISV?
>>>>> Do you build commercial solutions using Sybase products?
>>>>>
>>>>> Have you ever wanted to regularly communicate with your peers in an
>>>>> open forum?
>>>>> Now you can.
>>>>>
>>>>> Possible topics about which you may want the
>>>>> opinion and experience of your peers...
>>>>>
>>>>> - Marketing Your Software: Internet Business Models
>>>>> - How do I design visually stunning applications?
>>>>> - Sources for Components, Services
>>>>> - "Automated Testing Tools I have Loved"
>>>>> - How to Create a Trial Version of Your Software
>>>>> - How to Enact a License in commercial applications
>>>>> - How to Certify Your Product for a specific OS
>>>>> - How Do I Limit My Fiduciary and Legal Culpability?
>>>>> - Disaster Recovery: How Much Redundancy is Enough?
>>>>> - Does SOA Yet Have a Place in a Commercial Solution?
>>>>> - How Can I Implement SaaS Into My Current Solutions?
>>>>>
>>>>> Here is the most likely place to find who solved the problem you're
>>>>> experiencing today...six months ago.
>>>>> The purpose of this newsgroup is to provide a discussion space for
>>>>> those who build products or ship products with Sybase offerings.
>>>>> This forum is not meant to be a replacement for or an alternative to
>>>>> technical support, but has been established by Sybase as a means
>>>>> of providing a vehicle for its customers and prospects to openly
>>>>> and freely exchange information and ideas.
>>>>> Please feel free to post questions and to post answers for any
>>>>> questions where you may be of help.
>>>>>
>>>>> Please post and respond to questions in a professional, constructive
>>>>> manner.
>>>>> When posting a question, please wait 24 hours before reposting so that
>>>>> users have a chance
>>>>> to read the question.
>>>>>
>>>>> Welcome!
>>>>>
>>>>> Forum Purpose
>>>>> --------------------
>>>>>
>>>>> This forum was established by Sybase as a means of providing a vehicle
>>>>> for
>>>>> its customers and prospects to openly and freely exchange information
>>>>> and
>>>>> ideas. It is neither an alternative to, nor a replacement for a
>>>>> Customer
>>>>> Support Contract.
>>>>>
>>>>> 1. This is NOT a Sybase technical support forum and it is not the
>>>>> purpose
>>>>> of this forum to allow customers to get free technical support from
>>>>> Sybase.
>>>>> It is a place for users to help each other and exchange problems
>>>>> solutions,
>>>>> information, ideas, etc.
>>>>>
>>>>> 2. Sybase has no obligation to provide questions, problems, or
>>>>> provide
>>>>> anything other than a moderator to monitor the forum and insure its
>>>>> operation and availability, exchange problems solutions, information,
>>>>> ideas,
>>>>> etc. They do strive, however, to do much more than that as resources
>>>>> permit.
>>>>>
>>>>> 3. Sybase executives may monitor the forum to observe customer
>>>>> reaction to
>>>>> the product, keep up with users thoughts for new features, or offer
>>>>> executive opinions and viewpoints. Sybase employees may also assist
>>>>> on the
>>>>> forum when they have time available. They will offer help but may not
>>>>> be
>>>>> available on a regular basis based on their workload.
>>>>>
>>>>> 4. Sybase has selected a technically astute group of users to offer
>>>>> assistance to other Sybase users. The name of this group is
>>>>> TeamSybase. The moderator(s) of this forums is(are) member(s) of that
>>>>> group. Generally, neither they nor the other members of TeamSybase
>>>>> are
>>>>> Sybase employees, nor are they paid for their services in maintaining
>>>>> the
>>>>> forum. And, while they may answer questions in the forum from time to
>>>>> time,
>>>>> they are not responsible for ensuring that all questions receive
>>>>> answers.
>>>>>
>>>>> Guidelines
>>>>> --------------
>>>>>
>>>>> Please bear in mind that this is a moderated forum. As a result, it
>>>>> operates somewhat differently than a typical unmoderated newsgroup.
>>>>>
>>>>> 1. If you're using a company id, please post your name at the end of
>>>>> the
>>>>> message so that others may know who to address when sending an
>>>>> response. We
>>>>> would appreciate you using your full (real) name.
>>>>>
>>>>> 2. Please post the same question once in the forum that appears most
>>>>> appropriate and allow 36-72 hours for a response.
>>>>>
>>>>> 3. Advertising of any kind should be limited to the forums dedicated
>>>>> to
>>>>> that purpose (i.e., news.3rd_party_products, news.job_postings,
>>>>> etc.).
>>>>> Spamming of the forum will not be tolerated.
>>>>>
>>>>> 4. Profanity, obscenities, and abuse of forum members will not be
>>>>> tolerated.
>>>>>
>>>>> 5. Please refrain from sending "thanks" in the forum. Anyone
>>>>> desiring to
>>>>> thank the person assisting them should feel free to do so, but we
>>>>> would ask
>>>>> that this be done via e-mail to minimize traffic and allow members to
>>>>> review
>>>>> both problems and solutions.
>>>>>
>>>>> 6. Please refrain from sending personal messages in the forum. These
>>>>> conversations are more properly carried on in e-mail.
>>>>>
>>>>> 7. This forum is not particularly designed for the transfer of files.
>>>>> Therefore, if you need to make files accessible to other people,
>>>>> please
>>>>> handle it through private email or by making the file available on an
>>>>> ftp
>>>>> site or codexchange.sybase.com. Extremely large messages,
>>>>> particularly
>>>>> those containing embedded files, will be deleted without notice.
>>>>>
>>>>> 8. Please put specifics on the message header(not "Help", "Bug",
>>>>> "Urgent"
>>>>> or vague subject headers). People often only review headers for
>>>>> messages
>>>>> they are interested in. This is in your best interest in getting the
>>>>> most
>>>>> out of your message posting.
>>>>>
>>>>> 9. Please do not ask more than one question per message. If you have
>>>>> five
>>>>> questions, please post five messages. That way, duplication of
>>>>> answers for
>>>>> one problem and overlooked questions will be minimized.
>>>>>
>>>>> 10. When replying, ALWAYS include part of the message in your reply.
>>>>> Some of
>>>>> us CAN'T remember what happened five minutes ago, let alone yesterday.
>>>>>
>>>>> 11. The forum is primarily intended to assist Sybase end-users in
>>>>> obtaining the maximum benefit from its products. It is not intended
>>>>> for more
>>>>> general discussions, such as features of various products, product
>>>>> comparisons, etc. Please post messages of that type in more
>>>>> appropriate
>>>>> arenas, such as an public, unmoderated newsgroup.
>>>>>
>>>>> John Strano
>>>>> TeamSybase
>>>>> Sybase Technology Evangelist
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>
>


Randy Posted on 2008-02-05 19:28:21.0Z
From: "Randy" <cgreenwellNOSPAMPlease@sparusa.com>
Newsgroups: sybase.public.commercial-isv.general
References: <479f1a94$1@forums-1-dub> <479f7476$1@forums-1-dub> <47a1ee25@forums-1-dub> <47a20e74$1@forums-1-dub> <47a7613d@forums-1-dub> <47a8a942@forums-1-dub>
Subject: Re: Welcome
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Date: 5 Feb 2008 11:28:21 -0800
X-Trace: forums-1-dub 1202239701 10.22.241.152 (5 Feb 2008 11:28:21 -0800)
X-Original-Trace: 5 Feb 2008 11:28:21 -0800, vip152.sybase.com
X-Authenticated-User: pb110beta
Path: forums-1-dub!not-for-mail
Xref: forums-1-dub sybase.public.commercial-isv.general:42
Article PK: 103764

I've always had a problem with the license info on the ISUG web site. On
the WEB page

http://www.isug.com/common/NFRLicense.html

it says at the top of the page that you can use the software for development
but not for deployment. Then in the license itself, it says that you can not
use it for development, it is for demonstation only. Don't you need to
develop an application before you can demonstrate it?

I too am a Gold member and as one I have not taken advantage of any of the
free software, since I see no use for it, from a commercial stand point, due
to the license agreement.

Oh well... at least you are one step closer by being able to use it to learn
how it works.

"Ken Judkins" <nospam@nospam.com> wrote in message
news:47a8a942@forums-1-dub...
> Randy,
> I am already a Gold member of ISUG. I have the NFR PB11. However, it is
> a Not For Resale version, so you are not allowed to do anything more than
> learn on it. If I used that for profit, black helicopters with the
> PowerBuilder Police would swarm all over my house within minutes!
>
> Ken
>
>
>
>
>
> "Randy" <cgreenwellNOSPAMPlease@sparusa.com> wrote in message
> news:47a7613d@forums-1-dub...
>> Not to push ISUG, but you do get a bunch of nice stuff for free and some
>> at a discount. For example, you can get a copy of PB11 for free. Well,
>> not exactly free...but close.
>>
>> http://www.isug.com/common/GoldBenefits.html
>>
>> Randy
>>
>> "Ken Judkins" <nospam@nospam.com> wrote in message
>> news:47a20e74$1@forums-1-dub...
>>> John,
>>>
>>> I'm writing the applications in PB9 to pay for the upgrade to PB11! I'm
>>> cash only.
>>>
>>> I have a day job, but I'd like to see if I can succeed with some side
>>> projects. There are a billion potential customers on the Internet!
>>> I'll get some programs written and marketed, and do all my learning and
>>> mistakes using the tools I have. Since I don't "need" the money, I'll
>>> roll what I get into new toys, the first of which will probably be PB11.
>>>
>>> I say all that because I've been pushing for this newsgroup for a while,
>>> and I want Sybase to know how valuable the knowledge I get here will be.
>>>
>>> Ken
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> "John Strano[Sybase]" <nichtspamjstrano@csi.com> wrote in message
>>> news:47a1ee25@forums-1-dub...
>>>>>> John, you posed many of my questions in your original post! I'll
>>>>>> split them into separate threads when I make my posts.
>>>>
>>>> <G> Yes, please.
>>>>
>>>>>> I have PowerBuilder 9 Enterprise. Once I am successfully selling a
>>>>>> few products on a regular basis, I'd like to upgrade to PB 11.
>>>>
>>>> PowerBuilder 9 has been EOL for a while.
>>>> I'd hate for you to have a time-sensitive issue to solve
>>>> with a customer and not have us able to support you.
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>> John Strano - Sybase Technology Evangelist
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> "Ken Judkins" <nospam@nospam.com> wrote in message
>>>> news:479f7476$1@forums-1-dub...
>>>>> Thanks to Sybase for the Commercial-ISV newsgroup! I hope having a
>>>>> forum outside the "technical details" areas will help people like me
>>>>> get a product to market.
>>>>>
>>>>> I'd like to create applications I can sell over the Internet. I have
>>>>> many questions because I have never done anything like that before.
>>>>> Actually, John, you posed many of my questions in your original post!
>>>>> I'll split them into separate threads when I make my posts.
>>>>>
>>>>> As I was thinking over the questions I have, I saw the benefit of this
>>>>> newsgroup for Sybase. I have PowerBuilder 9 Enterprise. Once I am
>>>>> successfully selling a few products on a regular basis, I'd like to
>>>>> upgrade to PB 11. The advice and mentoring participants in this
>>>>> newsgroup provide will be invaluable, and everybody will benefit.
>>>>>
>>>>> Ken Judkins
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> "John Strano[Sybase]" <nichtspamjstrano@csi.com> wrote in message
>>>>> news:479f1a94$1@forums-1-dub...
>>>>>> Are you an ISV?
>>>>>> Do you build commercial solutions using Sybase products?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Have you ever wanted to regularly communicate with your peers in an
>>>>>> open forum?
>>>>>> Now you can.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Possible topics about which you may want the
>>>>>> opinion and experience of your peers...
>>>>>>
>>>>>> - Marketing Your Software: Internet Business Models
>>>>>> - How do I design visually stunning applications?
>>>>>> - Sources for Components, Services
>>>>>> - "Automated Testing Tools I have Loved"
>>>>>> - How to Create a Trial Version of Your Software
>>>>>> - How to Enact a License in commercial applications
>>>>>> - How to Certify Your Product for a specific OS
>>>>>> - How Do I Limit My Fiduciary and Legal Culpability?
>>>>>> - Disaster Recovery: How Much Redundancy is Enough?
>>>>>> - Does SOA Yet Have a Place in a Commercial Solution?
>>>>>> - How Can I Implement SaaS Into My Current Solutions?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Here is the most likely place to find who solved the problem you're
>>>>>> experiencing today...six months ago.
>>>>>> The purpose of this newsgroup is to provide a discussion space for
>>>>>> those who build products or ship products with Sybase offerings.
>>>>>> This forum is not meant to be a replacement for or an alternative to
>>>>>> technical support, but has been established by Sybase as a means
>>>>>> of providing a vehicle for its customers and prospects to openly
>>>>>> and freely exchange information and ideas.
>>>>>> Please feel free to post questions and to post answers for any
>>>>>> questions where you may be of help.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Please post and respond to questions in a professional, constructive
>>>>>> manner.
>>>>>> When posting a question, please wait 24 hours before reposting so
>>>>>> that users have a chance
>>>>>> to read the question.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Welcome!
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Forum Purpose
>>>>>> --------------------
>>>>>>
>>>>>> This forum was established by Sybase as a means of providing a
>>>>>> vehicle for
>>>>>> its customers and prospects to openly and freely exchange information
>>>>>> and
>>>>>> ideas. It is neither an alternative to, nor a replacement for a
>>>>>> Customer
>>>>>> Support Contract.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> 1. This is NOT a Sybase technical support forum and it is not the
>>>>>> purpose
>>>>>> of this forum to allow customers to get free technical support from
>>>>>> Sybase.
>>>>>> It is a place for users to help each other and exchange problems
>>>>>> solutions,
>>>>>> information, ideas, etc.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> 2. Sybase has no obligation to provide questions, problems, or
>>>>>> provide
>>>>>> anything other than a moderator to monitor the forum and insure its
>>>>>> operation and availability, exchange problems solutions, information,
>>>>>> ideas,
>>>>>> etc. They do strive, however, to do much more than that as resources
>>>>>> permit.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> 3. Sybase executives may monitor the forum to observe customer
>>>>>> reaction to
>>>>>> the product, keep up with users thoughts for new features, or offer
>>>>>> executive opinions and viewpoints. Sybase employees may also assist
>>>>>> on the
>>>>>> forum when they have time available. They will offer help but may
>>>>>> not be
>>>>>> available on a regular basis based on their workload.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> 4. Sybase has selected a technically astute group of users to offer
>>>>>> assistance to other Sybase users. The name of this group is
>>>>>> TeamSybase. The moderator(s) of this forums is(are) member(s) of
>>>>>> that
>>>>>> group. Generally, neither they nor the other members of TeamSybase
>>>>>> are
>>>>>> Sybase employees, nor are they paid for their services in maintaining
>>>>>> the
>>>>>> forum. And, while they may answer questions in the forum from time
>>>>>> to time,
>>>>>> they are not responsible for ensuring that all questions receive
>>>>>> answers.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Guidelines
>>>>>> --------------
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Please bear in mind that this is a moderated forum. As a result, it
>>>>>> operates somewhat differently than a typical unmoderated newsgroup.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> 1. If you're using a company id, please post your name at the end of
>>>>>> the
>>>>>> message so that others may know who to address when sending an
>>>>>> response. We
>>>>>> would appreciate you using your full (real) name.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> 2. Please post the same question once in the forum that appears most
>>>>>> appropriate and allow 36-72 hours for a response.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> 3. Advertising of any kind should be limited to the forums dedicated
>>>>>> to
>>>>>> that purpose (i.e., news.3rd_party_products, news.job_postings,
>>>>>> etc.).
>>>>>> Spamming of the forum will not be tolerated.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> 4. Profanity, obscenities, and abuse of forum members will not be
>>>>>> tolerated.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> 5. Please refrain from sending "thanks" in the forum. Anyone
>>>>>> desiring to
>>>>>> thank the person assisting them should feel free to do so, but we
>>>>>> would ask
>>>>>> that this be done via e-mail to minimize traffic and allow members to
>>>>>> review
>>>>>> both problems and solutions.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> 6. Please refrain from sending personal messages in the forum.
>>>>>> These
>>>>>> conversations are more properly carried on in e-mail.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> 7. This forum is not particularly designed for the transfer of
>>>>>> files.
>>>>>> Therefore, if you need to make files accessible to other people,
>>>>>> please
>>>>>> handle it through private email or by making the file available on an
>>>>>> ftp
>>>>>> site or codexchange.sybase.com. Extremely large messages,
>>>>>> particularly
>>>>>> those containing embedded files, will be deleted without notice.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> 8. Please put specifics on the message header(not "Help", "Bug",
>>>>>> "Urgent"
>>>>>> or vague subject headers). People often only review headers for
>>>>>> messages
>>>>>> they are interested in. This is in your best interest in getting the
>>>>>> most
>>>>>> out of your message posting.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> 9. Please do not ask more than one question per message. If you
>>>>>> have five
>>>>>> questions, please post five messages. That way, duplication of
>>>>>> answers for
>>>>>> one problem and overlooked questions will be minimized.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> 10. When replying, ALWAYS include part of the message in your reply.
>>>>>> Some of
>>>>>> us CAN'T remember what happened five minutes ago, let alone
>>>>>> yesterday.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> 11. The forum is primarily intended to assist Sybase end-users in
>>>>>> obtaining the maximum benefit from its products. It is not intended
>>>>>> for more
>>>>>> general discussions, such as features of various products, product
>>>>>> comparisons, etc. Please post messages of that type in more
>>>>>> appropriate
>>>>>> arenas, such as an public, unmoderated newsgroup.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> John Strano
>>>>>> TeamSybase
>>>>>> Sybase Technology Evangelist
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>
>


John Strano[Sybase] Posted on 2008-02-07 18:49:52.0Z
From: "John Strano[Sybase]" <nichtspamjstrano@csi.com>
Newsgroups: sybase.public.commercial-isv.general
References: <479f1a94$1@forums-1-dub> <479f7476$1@forums-1-dub> <47a1ee25@forums-1-dub> <47a20e74$1@forums-1-dub> <47a7613d@forums-1-dub> <47a8a942@forums-1-dub> <47a8b8d5@forums-1-dub>
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The ISUG president has come back and said that
the wording will be corrected to be in alignment
with the appropriate wording in the NFR.

Thank you very much for your input.
--
John Strano - Sybase Technology Evangelist

"Randy" <cgreenwellNOSPAMPlease@sparusa.com> wrote in message
news:47a8b8d5@forums-1-dub...
> I've always had a problem with the license info on the ISUG web site. On
> the WEB page
>
> http://www.isug.com/common/NFRLicense.html
>
> it says at the top of the page that you can use the software for
> development but not for deployment. Then in the license itself, it says
> that you can not use it for development, it is for demonstation only.
> Don't you need to develop an application before you can demonstrate it?
>
> I too am a Gold member and as one I have not taken advantage of any of the
> free software, since I see no use for it, from a commercial stand point,
> due to the license agreement.
>
> Oh well... at least you are one step closer by being able to use it to
> learn how it works.
>
>
> "Ken Judkins" <nospam@nospam.com> wrote in message
> news:47a8a942@forums-1-dub...
>> Randy,
>> I am already a Gold member of ISUG. I have the NFR PB11. However, it is
>> a Not For Resale version, so you are not allowed to do anything more than
>> learn on it. If I used that for profit, black helicopters with the
>> PowerBuilder Police would swarm all over my house within minutes!
>>
>> Ken
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> "Randy" <cgreenwellNOSPAMPlease@sparusa.com> wrote in message
>> news:47a7613d@forums-1-dub...
>>> Not to push ISUG, but you do get a bunch of nice stuff for free and some
>>> at a discount. For example, you can get a copy of PB11 for free. Well,
>>> not exactly free...but close.
>>>
>>> http://www.isug.com/common/GoldBenefits.html
>>>
>>> Randy
>>>
>>> "Ken Judkins" <nospam@nospam.com> wrote in message
>>> news:47a20e74$1@forums-1-dub...
>>>> John,
>>>>
>>>> I'm writing the applications in PB9 to pay for the upgrade to PB11!
>>>> I'm cash only.
>>>>
>>>> I have a day job, but I'd like to see if I can succeed with some side
>>>> projects. There are a billion potential customers on the Internet!
>>>> I'll get some programs written and marketed, and do all my learning and
>>>> mistakes using the tools I have. Since I don't "need" the money, I'll
>>>> roll what I get into new toys, the first of which will probably be
>>>> PB11.
>>>>
>>>> I say all that because I've been pushing for this newsgroup for a
>>>> while, and I want Sybase to know how valuable the knowledge I get here
>>>> will be.
>>>>
>>>> Ken
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> "John Strano[Sybase]" <nichtspamjstrano@csi.com> wrote in message
>>>> news:47a1ee25@forums-1-dub...
>>>>>>> John, you posed many of my questions in your original post! I'll
>>>>>>> split them into separate threads when I make my posts.
>>>>>
>>>>> <G> Yes, please.
>>>>>
>>>>>>> I have PowerBuilder 9 Enterprise. Once I am successfully selling a
>>>>>>> few products on a regular basis, I'd like to upgrade to PB 11.
>>>>>
>>>>> PowerBuilder 9 has been EOL for a while.
>>>>> I'd hate for you to have a time-sensitive issue to solve
>>>>> with a customer and not have us able to support you.
>>>>>
>>>>> --
>>>>> John Strano - Sybase Technology Evangelist
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> "Ken Judkins" <nospam@nospam.com> wrote in message
>>>>> news:479f7476$1@forums-1-dub...
>>>>>> Thanks to Sybase for the Commercial-ISV newsgroup! I hope having a
>>>>>> forum outside the "technical details" areas will help people like me
>>>>>> get a product to market.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I'd like to create applications I can sell over the Internet. I have
>>>>>> many questions because I have never done anything like that before.
>>>>>> Actually, John, you posed many of my questions in your original post!
>>>>>> I'll split them into separate threads when I make my posts.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> As I was thinking over the questions I have, I saw the benefit of
>>>>>> this newsgroup for Sybase. I have PowerBuilder 9 Enterprise. Once I
>>>>>> am successfully selling a few products on a regular basis, I'd like
>>>>>> to upgrade to PB 11. The advice and mentoring participants in this
>>>>>> newsgroup provide will be invaluable, and everybody will benefit.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Ken Judkins
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> "John Strano[Sybase]" <nichtspamjstrano@csi.com> wrote in message
>>>>>> news:479f1a94$1@forums-1-dub...
>>>>>>> Are you an ISV?
>>>>>>> Do you build commercial solutions using Sybase products?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Have you ever wanted to regularly communicate with your peers in an
>>>>>>> open forum?
>>>>>>> Now you can.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Possible topics about which you may want the
>>>>>>> opinion and experience of your peers...
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> - Marketing Your Software: Internet Business Models
>>>>>>> - How do I design visually stunning applications?
>>>>>>> - Sources for Components, Services
>>>>>>> - "Automated Testing Tools I have Loved"
>>>>>>> - How to Create a Trial Version of Your Software
>>>>>>> - How to Enact a License in commercial applications
>>>>>>> - How to Certify Your Product for a specific OS
>>>>>>> - How Do I Limit My Fiduciary and Legal Culpability?
>>>>>>> - Disaster Recovery: How Much Redundancy is Enough?
>>>>>>> - Does SOA Yet Have a Place in a Commercial Solution?
>>>>>>> - How Can I Implement SaaS Into My Current Solutions?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Here is the most likely place to find who solved the problem you're
>>>>>>> experiencing today...six months ago.
>>>>>>> The purpose of this newsgroup is to provide a discussion space for
>>>>>>> those who build products or ship products with Sybase offerings.
>>>>>>> This forum is not meant to be a replacement for or an alternative to
>>>>>>> technical support, but has been established by Sybase as a means
>>>>>>> of providing a vehicle for its customers and prospects to openly
>>>>>>> and freely exchange information and ideas.
>>>>>>> Please feel free to post questions and to post answers for any
>>>>>>> questions where you may be of help.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Please post and respond to questions in a professional, constructive
>>>>>>> manner.
>>>>>>> When posting a question, please wait 24 hours before reposting so
>>>>>>> that users have a chance
>>>>>>> to read the question.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Welcome!
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Forum Purpose
>>>>>>> --------------------
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> This forum was established by Sybase as a means of providing a
>>>>>>> vehicle for
>>>>>>> its customers and prospects to openly and freely exchange
>>>>>>> information and
>>>>>>> ideas. It is neither an alternative to, nor a replacement for a
>>>>>>> Customer
>>>>>>> Support Contract.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> 1. This is NOT a Sybase technical support forum and it is not the
>>>>>>> purpose
>>>>>>> of this forum to allow customers to get free technical support from
>>>>>>> Sybase.
>>>>>>> It is a place for users to help each other and exchange problems
>>>>>>> solutions,
>>>>>>> information, ideas, etc.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> 2. Sybase has no obligation to provide questions, problems, or
>>>>>>> provide
>>>>>>> anything other than a moderator to monitor the forum and insure its
>>>>>>> operation and availability, exchange problems solutions,
>>>>>>> information, ideas,
>>>>>>> etc. They do strive, however, to do much more than that as
>>>>>>> resources
>>>>>>> permit.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> 3. Sybase executives may monitor the forum to observe customer
>>>>>>> reaction to
>>>>>>> the product, keep up with users thoughts for new features, or offer
>>>>>>> executive opinions and viewpoints. Sybase employees may also assist
>>>>>>> on the
>>>>>>> forum when they have time available. They will offer help but may
>>>>>>> not be
>>>>>>> available on a regular basis based on their workload.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> 4. Sybase has selected a technically astute group of users to offer
>>>>>>> assistance to other Sybase users. The name of this group is
>>>>>>> TeamSybase. The moderator(s) of this forums is(are) member(s) of
>>>>>>> that
>>>>>>> group. Generally, neither they nor the other members of TeamSybase
>>>>>>> are
>>>>>>> Sybase employees, nor are they paid for their services in
>>>>>>> maintaining the
>>>>>>> forum. And, while they may answer questions in the forum from time
>>>>>>> to time,
>>>>>>> they are not responsible for ensuring that all questions receive
>>>>>>> answers.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Guidelines
>>>>>>> --------------
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Please bear in mind that this is a moderated forum. As a result, it
>>>>>>> operates somewhat differently than a typical unmoderated newsgroup.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> 1. If you're using a company id, please post your name at the end
>>>>>>> of the
>>>>>>> message so that others may know who to address when sending an
>>>>>>> response. We
>>>>>>> would appreciate you using your full (real) name.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> 2. Please post the same question once in the forum that appears
>>>>>>> most
>>>>>>> appropriate and allow 36-72 hours for a response.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> 3. Advertising of any kind should be limited to the forums
>>>>>>> dedicated to
>>>>>>> that purpose (i.e., news.3rd_party_products, news.job_postings,
>>>>>>> etc.).
>>>>>>> Spamming of the forum will not be tolerated.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> 4. Profanity, obscenities, and abuse of forum members will not be
>>>>>>> tolerated.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> 5. Please refrain from sending "thanks" in the forum. Anyone
>>>>>>> desiring to
>>>>>>> thank the person assisting them should feel free to do so, but we
>>>>>>> would ask
>>>>>>> that this be done via e-mail to minimize traffic and allow members
>>>>>>> to review
>>>>>>> both problems and solutions.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> 6. Please refrain from sending personal messages in the forum.
>>>>>>> These
>>>>>>> conversations are more properly carried on in e-mail.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> 7. This forum is not particularly designed for the transfer of
>>>>>>> files.
>>>>>>> Therefore, if you need to make files accessible to other people,
>>>>>>> please
>>>>>>> handle it through private email or by making the file available on
>>>>>>> an ftp
>>>>>>> site or codexchange.sybase.com. Extremely large messages,
>>>>>>> particularly
>>>>>>> those containing embedded files, will be deleted without notice.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> 8. Please put specifics on the message header(not "Help", "Bug",
>>>>>>> "Urgent"
>>>>>>> or vague subject headers). People often only review headers for
>>>>>>> messages
>>>>>>> they are interested in. This is in your best interest in getting
>>>>>>> the most
>>>>>>> out of your message posting.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> 9. Please do not ask more than one question per message. If you
>>>>>>> have five
>>>>>>> questions, please post five messages. That way, duplication of
>>>>>>> answers for
>>>>>>> one problem and overlooked questions will be minimized.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> 10. When replying, ALWAYS include part of the message in your reply.
>>>>>>> Some of
>>>>>>> us CAN'T remember what happened five minutes ago, let alone
>>>>>>> yesterday.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> 11. The forum is primarily intended to assist Sybase end-users in
>>>>>>> obtaining the maximum benefit from its products. It is not intended
>>>>>>> for more
>>>>>>> general discussions, such as features of various products, product
>>>>>>> comparisons, etc. Please post messages of that type in more
>>>>>>> appropriate
>>>>>>> arenas, such as an public, unmoderated newsgroup.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> John Strano
>>>>>>> TeamSybase
>>>>>>> Sybase Technology Evangelist
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>
>


Sybase Team - Chennai. Posted on 2008-04-07 07:43:58.0Z
Sender: 75b5.47f9bfaf.1804289383@sybase.com
From: Sybase Team - Chennai.
Newsgroups: sybase.public.commercial-isv.general
Subject: Needs Solution for the following problem................
X-Mailer: WebNews to Mail Gateway v1.1t
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Article PK: 103833

The Adaptive server got automatically expand the selected
elements in the 'select *' statement in a storeproc.But ,we
don't want to expand the selected columns using 'select *'.

Can anyone help on this?


Rob Verschoor Posted on 2008-04-07 09:05:34.0Z
Reply-To: "Rob Verschoor" <rob@DO.NOT.SPAM.sypron.nl.REMOVE.THIS.DECOY>
From: "Rob Verschoor" <rob@DO.NOT.SPAM.sypron.nl.REMOVE.THIS.DECOY>
Newsgroups: sybase.public.commercial-isv.general
References: <47ab52d0$1@forums-1-dub> <47f9c2ae.75e7.1681692777@sybase.com>
Subject: Re: Needs Solution for the following problem................
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Article PK: 103828

Check out http://www.sypron.nl/new12501.html#t243 ...

HTH,

Rob V.
-------------------------------------------------------------
Rob Verschoor

Certified Sybase Professional DBA for ASE 12.5/12.0/11.5/11.0
and Replication Server 12.5 / TeamSybase

Author of Sybase books (order online at www.sypron.nl/shop):
"Tips, Tricks & Recipes for Sybase ASE" (ASE 15 edition)
"The Complete Sybase ASE Quick Reference Guide"
"The Complete Sybase Replication Server Quick Reference Guide"

mailto:rob@YOUR.SPAM.sypron.nl.NOT.FOR.ME
http://www.sypron.nl
Sypron B.V., P.O.Box 10695, 2501HR Den Haag, The Netherlands
-------------------------------------------------------------

<Sybase Team - Chennai.> wrote in message
news:47f9c2ae.75e7.1681692777@sybase.com...
> The Adaptive server got automatically expand the selected
> elements in the 'select *' statement in a storeproc.But ,we
> don't want to expand the selected columns using 'select *'.
>
> Can anyone help on this?


Breck Carter [sqlanywhere.blogspot.com] Posted on 2008-04-07 11:45:18.0Z
From: "Breck Carter [sqlanywhere.blogspot.com]" <NOSPAM__breck.carter@gmail.com>
Newsgroups: sybase.public.commercial-isv.general
Subject: Re: Needs Solution for the following problem................
Organization: RisingRoad Professional Services
Reply-To: NOSPAM__breck.carter@gmail.com
Message-ID: <u82kv39m6c81ekdpnkf4fsbk2imthmv423@4ax.com>
References: <47ab52d0$1@forums-1-dub> <47f9c2ae.75e7.1681692777@sybase.com> <47f9e3de$1@forums-1-dub>
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Article PK: 103829

Cool site! (oh wait, it's yours, I knew that :)

Breck

On 7 Apr 2008 02:05:34 -0700, "Rob Verschoor"

<rob@DO.NOT.SPAM.sypron.nl.REMOVE.THIS.DECOY> wrote:

>Check out http://www.sypron.nl/new12501.html#t243 ...
>
>HTH,
>
>Rob V.
>-------------------------------------------------------------
>Rob Verschoor
>
>Certified Sybase Professional DBA for ASE 12.5/12.0/11.5/11.0
>and Replication Server 12.5 / TeamSybase
>
>Author of Sybase books (order online at www.sypron.nl/shop):
>"Tips, Tricks & Recipes for Sybase ASE" (ASE 15 edition)
>"The Complete Sybase ASE Quick Reference Guide"
>"The Complete Sybase Replication Server Quick Reference Guide"
>
>mailto:rob@YOUR.SPAM.sypron.nl.NOT.FOR.ME
>http://www.sypron.nl
>Sypron B.V., P.O.Box 10695, 2501HR Den Haag, The Netherlands
>-------------------------------------------------------------
>
><Sybase Team - Chennai.> wrote in message
>news:47f9c2ae.75e7.1681692777@sybase.com...
>> The Adaptive server got automatically expand the selected
>> elements in the 'select *' statement in a storeproc.But ,we
>> don't want to expand the selected columns using 'select *'.
>>
>> Can anyone help on this?
>

--
Breck Carter http://sqlanywhere.blogspot.com/

RisingRoad SQL Anywhere and MobiLink Professional Services
breck.carter@risingroad.com


Derek Asirvadem Posted on 2008-04-07 08:41:20.0Z
From: Derek Asirvadem <derek.asirvadem@gmailDOTcom>
Organization: Software Gems Pty Ltd
Newsgroups: sybase.public.commercial-isv.general
Message-ID: <47f9de2e@forums-1-dub>
References: <479f1a94$1@forums-1-dub> <479f7476$1@forums-1-dub> <47a1ee25@forums-1-dub> <47a20e74$1@forums-1-dub> <47a7613d@forums-1-dub> <47a8a942@forums-1-dub> <47a8b8d5@forums-1-dub> <47ab52d0$1@forums-1-dub> <47f9c2ae.75e7.1681692777@sybase.com>
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Article PK: 103832

On 2008-04-07 17:43:58 +1000, Sybase Team - Chennai. said:

> The Adaptive server got automatically expand the selected
> elements in the 'select *' statement in a storeproc.But ,we
> don't want to expand the selected columns using 'select *'.
>
> Can anyone help on this?

yeah. The problem needs to be understood. In the first place, you
should not use "*" for code that is intended for production, ie. you do
not want to change it excpet by plan (otherwise every time the Db
(column sequence) changes, you have to change your code. If you used a
column list, you are impervious to Db changes.

Now for those who do not do this, who are vulnerable to "*" changing,
Sybase come up with this brilliant (not) idea to help them with a tiny
bit of isolation from Db changes. By expanding "*" and then storing it
with the sproc, at the time. Bit idiotic AFAIC.

Point is, it does not harm those who have "good" code (Use a column
list); it helps "bad" a tiny bit.
--
Cheers
Derek
Senior Sybase DBA / Information Architect
Copyright © 2008 Software Gems Pty Ltd
Quality Standards = Zero Maintenance + Zero Surprises
Performance Standards = Predictability + Scaleability


Breck Carter [sqlanywhere.blogspot.com] Posted on 2008-04-07 11:43:48.0Z
From: "Breck Carter [sqlanywhere.blogspot.com]" <NOSPAM__breck.carter@gmail.com>
Newsgroups: sybase.public.commercial-isv.general
Subject: Re: Needs Solution for the following problem................
Organization: RisingRoad Professional Services
Reply-To: NOSPAM__breck.carter@gmail.com
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Article PK: 103830

Valid uses do exist for select *, in production; e.g., code that
"needs all the columns, even after a schema change". Select * isolates
that kind of code from schema changes, where select explicit-list does
not. I'm not sure if ASE supports that, but this isn't an ASE-only
newsgroup.

Breck

On 7 Apr 2008 01:41:20 -0700, Derek Asirvadem

<derek.asirvadem@gmailDOTcom> wrote:

>On 2008-04-07 17:43:58 +1000, Sybase Team - Chennai. said:
>
>> The Adaptive server got automatically expand the selected
>> elements in the 'select *' statement in a storeproc.But ,we
>> don't want to expand the selected columns using 'select *'.
>>
>> Can anyone help on this?
>
>yeah. The problem needs to be understood. In the first place, you
>should not use "*" for code that is intended for production, ie. you do
>not want to change it excpet by plan (otherwise every time the Db
>(column sequence) changes, you have to change your code. If you used a
>column list, you are impervious to Db changes.
>
>Now for those who do not do this, who are vulnerable to "*" changing,
>Sybase come up with this brilliant (not) idea to help them with a tiny
>bit of isolation from Db changes. By expanding "*" and then storing it
>with the sproc, at the time. Bit idiotic AFAIC.
>
>Point is, it does not harm those who have "good" code (Use a column
>list); it helps "bad" a tiny bit.

--
Breck Carter http://sqlanywhere.blogspot.com/

RisingRoad SQL Anywhere and MobiLink Professional Services
breck.carter@risingroad.com


Derek Asirvadem Posted on 2008-04-07 12:58:28.0Z
From: Derek Asirvadem <derek.asirvadem@gmailDOTcom>
Organization: Software Gems Pty Ltd
Newsgroups: sybase.public.commercial-isv.general
Message-ID: <47fa1a72@forums-1-dub>
References: <479f1a94$1@forums-1-dub> <479f7476$1@forums-1-dub> <47a1ee25@forums-1-dub> <47a20e74$1@forums-1-dub> <47a7613d@forums-1-dub> <47a8a942@forums-1-dub> <47a8b8d5@forums-1-dub> <47ab52d0$1@forums-1-dub> <47f9c2ae.75e7.1681692777@sybase.com> <47f9de2e@forums-1-dub> <tu1kv3tvm8d9sh3nd2psoqfveb9uhiv2hl@4ax.com>
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> On 2008-04-07 21:43:48 +1000, "Breck Carter [sqlanywhere.blogspot.com]"
> NOSPAM__breck.carter@gmail.com> said:
>
> Valid uses do exist for select *, in production; e.g., code that
> "needs all the columns, even after a schema change". Select * isolates
> that kind of code from schema changes, where select explicit-list does
> not. I'm not sure if ASE supports that, but this isn't an ASE-only
> newsgroup.

Select * does not isolate itself from anything, really, it just
pretends to, or delays the pain until the sproc is recreated.

How does "needs all the columns, even after a schema change" work ???
(a) if you gave it a column-list, you're fine. (b) If select * was
expanded, then after the schema change you are not getting "all
columns", you are getting the previous "all columns". Unless you
recreate the sproc. In any cae, you wioll have fun at the client-end
of your app, if you are not in reasonable control of the column list.

BTW I was answering the OP's question, I was not making a comment on
the validity of the um select *. But not that I am drawn into, let me
say that it has no place in production code, if you want predictable
maintenance and upgrades. We explicitly disallow it by standard.
--
Cheers
Derek
Senior Sybase DBA / Information Architect
Copyright © 2008 Software Gems Pty Ltd
Quality Standards = Zero Maintenance + Zero Surprises
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John Strano[Sybase] Posted on 2008-02-07 17:35:09.0Z
From: "John Strano[Sybase]" <nichtspamjstrano@csi.com>
Newsgroups: sybase.public.commercial-isv.general
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>>...black helicopters with the PowerBuilder Police...

<G>
Thup thup thup thup thup.

Thanks for your and Randy's comments on the ambiguity.
I'll pass them on to ISUG directly.

--
John Strano - Sybase Technology Evangelist

"Ken Judkins" <nospam@nospam.com> wrote in message
news:47a8a942@forums-1-dub...
> Randy,
>
> I am already a Gold member of ISUG. I have the NFR PB11. However, it is
> a Not For Resale version, so you are not allowed to do anything more than
> learn on it. If I used that for profit, black helicopters with the
> PowerBuilder Police would swarm all over my house within minutes!
>
> Ken
>
>
>
>
>
> "Randy" <cgreenwellNOSPAMPlease@sparusa.com> wrote in message
> news:47a7613d@forums-1-dub...
>> Not to push ISUG, but you do get a bunch of nice stuff for free and some
>> at a discount. For example, you can get a copy of PB11 for free. Well,
>> not exactly free...but close.
>>
>> http://www.isug.com/common/GoldBenefits.html
>>
>> Randy
>>
>> "Ken Judkins" <nospam@nospam.com> wrote in message
>> news:47a20e74$1@forums-1-dub...
>>> John,
>>>
>>> I'm writing the applications in PB9 to pay for the upgrade to PB11! I'm
>>> cash only.
>>>
>>> I have a day job, but I'd like to see if I can succeed with some side
>>> projects. There are a billion potential customers on the Internet!
>>> I'll get some programs written and marketed, and do all my learning and
>>> mistakes using the tools I have. Since I don't "need" the money, I'll
>>> roll what I get into new toys, the first of which will probably be PB11.
>>>
>>> I say all that because I've been pushing for this newsgroup for a while,
>>> and I want Sybase to know how valuable the knowledge I get here will be.
>>>
>>> Ken
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> "John Strano[Sybase]" <nichtspamjstrano@csi.com> wrote in message
>>> news:47a1ee25@forums-1-dub...
>>>>>> John, you posed many of my questions in your original post! I'll
>>>>>> split them into separate threads when I make my posts.
>>>>
>>>> <G> Yes, please.
>>>>
>>>>>> I have PowerBuilder 9 Enterprise. Once I am successfully selling a
>>>>>> few products on a regular basis, I'd like to upgrade to PB 11.
>>>>
>>>> PowerBuilder 9 has been EOL for a while.
>>>> I'd hate for you to have a time-sensitive issue to solve
>>>> with a customer and not have us able to support you.
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>> John Strano - Sybase Technology Evangelist
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> "Ken Judkins" <nospam@nospam.com> wrote in message
>>>> news:479f7476$1@forums-1-dub...
>>>>> Thanks to Sybase for the Commercial-ISV newsgroup! I hope having a
>>>>> forum outside the "technical details" areas will help people like me
>>>>> get a product to market.
>>>>>
>>>>> I'd like to create applications I can sell over the Internet. I have
>>>>> many questions because I have never done anything like that before.
>>>>> Actually, John, you posed many of my questions in your original post!
>>>>> I'll split them into separate threads when I make my posts.
>>>>>
>>>>> As I was thinking over the questions I have, I saw the benefit of this
>>>>> newsgroup for Sybase. I have PowerBuilder 9 Enterprise. Once I am
>>>>> successfully selling a few products on a regular basis, I'd like to
>>>>> upgrade to PB 11. The advice and mentoring participants in this
>>>>> newsgroup provide will be invaluable, and everybody will benefit.
>>>>>
>>>>> Ken Judkins
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> "John Strano[Sybase]" <nichtspamjstrano@csi.com> wrote in message
>>>>> news:479f1a94$1@forums-1-dub...
>>>>>> Are you an ISV?
>>>>>> Do you build commercial solutions using Sybase products?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Have you ever wanted to regularly communicate with your peers in an
>>>>>> open forum?
>>>>>> Now you can.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Possible topics about which you may want the
>>>>>> opinion and experience of your peers...
>>>>>>
>>>>>> - Marketing Your Software: Internet Business Models
>>>>>> - How do I design visually stunning applications?
>>>>>> - Sources for Components, Services
>>>>>> - "Automated Testing Tools I have Loved"
>>>>>> - How to Create a Trial Version of Your Software
>>>>>> - How to Enact a License in commercial applications
>>>>>> - How to Certify Your Product for a specific OS
>>>>>> - How Do I Limit My Fiduciary and Legal Culpability?
>>>>>> - Disaster Recovery: How Much Redundancy is Enough?
>>>>>> - Does SOA Yet Have a Place in a Commercial Solution?
>>>>>> - How Can I Implement SaaS Into My Current Solutions?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Here is the most likely place to find who solved the problem you're
>>>>>> experiencing today...six months ago.
>>>>>> The purpose of this newsgroup is to provide a discussion space for
>>>>>> those who build products or ship products with Sybase offerings.
>>>>>> This forum is not meant to be a replacement for or an alternative to
>>>>>> technical support, but has been established by Sybase as a means
>>>>>> of providing a vehicle for its customers and prospects to openly
>>>>>> and freely exchange information and ideas.
>>>>>> Please feel free to post questions and to post answers for any
>>>>>> questions where you may be of help.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Please post and respond to questions in a professional, constructive
>>>>>> manner.
>>>>>> When posting a question, please wait 24 hours before reposting so
>>>>>> that users have a chance
>>>>>> to read the question.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Welcome!
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Forum Purpose
>>>>>> --------------------
>>>>>>
>>>>>> This forum was established by Sybase as a means of providing a
>>>>>> vehicle for
>>>>>> its customers and prospects to openly and freely exchange information
>>>>>> and
>>>>>> ideas. It is neither an alternative to, nor a replacement for a
>>>>>> Customer
>>>>>> Support Contract.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> 1. This is NOT a Sybase technical support forum and it is not the
>>>>>> purpose
>>>>>> of this forum to allow customers to get free technical support from
>>>>>> Sybase.
>>>>>> It is a place for users to help each other and exchange problems
>>>>>> solutions,
>>>>>> information, ideas, etc.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> 2. Sybase has no obligation to provide questions, problems, or
>>>>>> provide
>>>>>> anything other than a moderator to monitor the forum and insure its
>>>>>> operation and availability, exchange problems solutions, information,
>>>>>> ideas,
>>>>>> etc. They do strive, however, to do much more than that as resources
>>>>>> permit.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> 3. Sybase executives may monitor the forum to observe customer
>>>>>> reaction to
>>>>>> the product, keep up with users thoughts for new features, or offer
>>>>>> executive opinions and viewpoints. Sybase employees may also assist
>>>>>> on the
>>>>>> forum when they have time available. They will offer help but may
>>>>>> not be
>>>>>> available on a regular basis based on their workload.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> 4. Sybase has selected a technically astute group of users to offer
>>>>>> assistance to other Sybase users. The name of this group is
>>>>>> TeamSybase. The moderator(s) of this forums is(are) member(s) of
>>>>>> that
>>>>>> group. Generally, neither they nor the other members of TeamSybase
>>>>>> are
>>>>>> Sybase employees, nor are they paid for their services in maintaining
>>>>>> the
>>>>>> forum. And, while they may answer questions in the forum from time
>>>>>> to time,
>>>>>> they are not responsible for ensuring that all questions receive
>>>>>> answers.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Guidelines
>>>>>> --------------
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Please bear in mind that this is a moderated forum. As a result, it
>>>>>> operates somewhat differently than a typical unmoderated newsgroup.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> 1. If you're using a company id, please post your name at the end of
>>>>>> the
>>>>>> message so that others may know who to address when sending an
>>>>>> response. We
>>>>>> would appreciate you using your full (real) name.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> 2. Please post the same question once in the forum that appears most
>>>>>> appropriate and allow 36-72 hours for a response.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> 3. Advertising of any kind should be limited to the forums dedicated
>>>>>> to
>>>>>> that purpose (i.e., news.3rd_party_products, news.job_postings,
>>>>>> etc.).
>>>>>> Spamming of the forum will not be tolerated.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> 4. Profanity, obscenities, and abuse of forum members will not be
>>>>>> tolerated.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> 5. Please refrain from sending "thanks" in the forum. Anyone
>>>>>> desiring to
>>>>>> thank the person assisting them should feel free to do so, but we
>>>>>> would ask
>>>>>> that this be done via e-mail to minimize traffic and allow members to
>>>>>> review
>>>>>> both problems and solutions.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> 6. Please refrain from sending personal messages in the forum.
>>>>>> These
>>>>>> conversations are more properly carried on in e-mail.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> 7. This forum is not particularly designed for the transfer of
>>>>>> files.
>>>>>> Therefore, if you need to make files accessible to other people,
>>>>>> please
>>>>>> handle it through private email or by making the file available on an
>>>>>> ftp
>>>>>> site or codexchange.sybase.com. Extremely large messages,
>>>>>> particularly
>>>>>> those containing embedded files, will be deleted without notice.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> 8. Please put specifics on the message header(not "Help", "Bug",
>>>>>> "Urgent"
>>>>>> or vague subject headers). People often only review headers for
>>>>>> messages
>>>>>> they are interested in. This is in your best interest in getting the
>>>>>> most
>>>>>> out of your message posting.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> 9. Please do not ask more than one question per message. If you
>>>>>> have five
>>>>>> questions, please post five messages. That way, duplication of
>>>>>> answers for
>>>>>> one problem and overlooked questions will be minimized.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> 10. When replying, ALWAYS include part of the message in your reply.
>>>>>> Some of
>>>>>> us CAN'T remember what happened five minutes ago, let alone
>>>>>> yesterday.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> 11. The forum is primarily intended to assist Sybase end-users in
>>>>>> obtaining the maximum benefit from its products. It is not intended
>>>>>> for more
>>>>>> general discussions, such as features of various products, product
>>>>>> comparisons, etc. Please post messages of that type in more
>>>>>> appropriate
>>>>>> arenas, such as an public, unmoderated newsgroup.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> John Strano
>>>>>> TeamSybase
>>>>>> Sybase Technology Evangelist
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>
>