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re sysmon dumping it's output into a table ?

12 posts in Product Futures Discussion Last posting was on 2002-06-26 14:12:30.0Z
J Posted on 2002-06-06 08:47:26.0Z
From: "J" <rs2@rocketmail.com>
Subject: re sysmon dumping it's output into a table ?
Date: Thu, 6 Jun 2002 10:47:26 +0200
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I'm not sure if this has been requested already, but when looking at
sysmon's text-based output, it would seem to be a good idea to dump the
results into a table ?
It's also something which could come about fairly easily for database
vendor, would'nt you say ?

cheers

J


girish Posted on 2002-06-07 21:23:08.0Z
From: girish
Date: Fri, 7 Jun 2002 17:23:08 -0400
Newsgroups: sybase.public.ase.product_futures_discussion
Subject: Re: re sysmon dumping it's output into a table ?
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Article PK: 93637

If you can provide us a little more information on what you're envisioning
it would help. Are you looking to put the entire
report into a table.
Thanks

Girish Vaitheeswaran
Staff Software Engineer
Server Performance.


J Posted on 2002-06-10 08:06:15.0Z
From: "J" <rs2@rocketmail.com>
References: <Y9t#JgTDCHA.277@forums.sybase.com> <AF5DE3EFF8B090CB007579A285256BD1.0034C90785256BD0@webforums>
Subject: Re: re sysmon dumping it's output into a table ?
Date: Mon, 10 Jun 2002 10:06:15 +0200
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Article PK: 93628

What I'm looking for is a single table containing a large number of columns
(on Col for each measure, in it's underived form)
This would include start & end-date, (duration is derived), and then the
Total values for each measurement,
such as Voluntary yields,
Deferred updates,
dealocks,
lock escalations,
etc etc.

The whole existing report as we know it then be run as an SP off the data,
and also off historical data.
This can now be used as a repository for future reference.

I'm in the process to write scripts to parse the sysmon-file, and shove it
into a table, to allow for analysis over time.
This would include data to be analysed for one day as we run one 1 minute
sysmon every 30 minutes.
But this is also very useful to analyse requests etc over a longer period,
susch as one day, etc.

Running the sysmons for such a short period allows us to identify spikes
easily, as it will show clearly, and may be smoothed over no-activity if the
sysmon was run for a very long period. It also shows us when a database
(usually tempdb) has longer checkpoint times .
Using this then to graph the results yields REALLY impressive results as far
a visualising the data effects.
This still needs a fairly straight head to interpret, but it is REALLY
usefull.

I'll send you some graphs of what we did at one of my previous sites, if
you're interested.
This will only contain a subset of all the measures (i.e. the one WE were
interested in), but it should be expanded to all measures (in my opinion).

Let me know if you need more details

Cheers

J

<girish> wrote in message
news:AF5DE3EFF8B090CB007579A285256BD1.0034C90785256BD0@webforums...
> If you can provide us a little more information on what you're envisioning
> it would help. Are you looking to put the entire
> report into a table.
> Thanks
>
> Girish Vaitheeswaran
> Staff Software Engineer
> Server Performance.


David Wein Posted on 2002-06-13 19:06:51.0Z
Message-ID: <3D08ED4B.86C8982E@sybase.com>
Date: Thu, 13 Jun 2002 14:06:51 -0500
From: David Wein <dwein@sybase.com>
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Subject: Re: re sysmon dumping it's output into a table ?
References: <Y9t#JgTDCHA.277@forums.sybase.com> <AF5DE3EFF8B090CB007579A285256BD1.0034C90785256BD0@webforums> <iTztAcFECHA.277@forums.sybase.com>
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Article PK: 93614

In a sense this is already done. Sysmon actually takes all of its data from the
sysmonitors table to begin with and puts it into report form. Not for the faint
of heart, but one could study the sysmon code (either from installmaster script
or sp_helptext) and determine which rows in sysmonitors correspond to which data
elements in the report. Sysmon actually copies this stuff from sysmonitors into
a temp table. One could roll their own to copy it into a non-temp table and
track for historical purposes, then write their own analysis routines to massage
the data.

-Dave

J wrote:

> What I'm looking for is a single table containing a large number of columns
> (on Col for each measure, in it's underived form)
> This would include start & end-date, (duration is derived), and then the
> Total values for each measurement,
> such as Voluntary yields,
> Deferred updates,
> dealocks,
> lock escalations,
> etc etc.
>
> The whole existing report as we know it then be run as an SP off the data,
> and also off historical data.
> This can now be used as a repository for future reference.
>
> I'm in the process to write scripts to parse the sysmon-file, and shove it
> into a table, to allow for analysis over time.
> This would include data to be analysed for one day as we run one 1 minute
> sysmon every 30 minutes.
> But this is also very useful to analyse requests etc over a longer period,
> susch as one day, etc.
>
> Running the sysmons for such a short period allows us to identify spikes
> easily, as it will show clearly, and may be smoothed over no-activity if the
> sysmon was run for a very long period. It also shows us when a database
> (usually tempdb) has longer checkpoint times .
> Using this then to graph the results yields REALLY impressive results as far
> a visualising the data effects.
> This still needs a fairly straight head to interpret, but it is REALLY
> usefull.
>
> I'll send you some graphs of what we did at one of my previous sites, if
> you're interested.
> This will only contain a subset of all the measures (i.e. the one WE were
> interested in), but it should be expanded to all measures (in my opinion).
>
> Let me know if you need more details
>
> Cheers
>
> J
>
> <girish> wrote in message
> news:AF5DE3EFF8B090CB007579A285256BD1.0034C90785256BD0@webforums...
> > If you can provide us a little more information on what you're envisioning
> > it would help. Are you looking to put the entire
> > report into a table.
> > Thanks
> >
> > Girish Vaitheeswaran
> > Staff Software Engineer
> > Server Performance.


J Posted on 2002-06-20 13:03:58.0Z
From: "J" <rs2@rocketmail.com>
References: <Y9t#JgTDCHA.277@forums.sybase.com> <AF5DE3EFF8B090CB007579A285256BD1.0034C90785256BD0@webforums> <iTztAcFECHA.277@forums.sybase.com> <3D08ED4B.86C8982E@sybase.com>
Subject: Re: re sysmon dumping it's output into a table ?
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I agree, but the point is that with every new EBF, rollip, or version this
now has to re-done by ....?
It would NOT add a lot of maintenance for Sybase to do this, into a single
table, using time-of-run relationship to keep the results seperate.

Then you and I and everone out there can start writing weird and wonderful
reports against a relational table-structure, from which we can manage
sysmon-over-time data quite a bit easier, thus reducing the cost of
ownership, and standardising a bit of this process which should've been done
long ago.

Comments ?

"David Wein" <dwein@sybase.com> wrote in message
news:3D08ED4B.86C8982E@sybase.com...
> In a sense this is already done. Sysmon actually takes all of its data
from the
> sysmonitors table to begin with and puts it into report form. Not for the
faint
> of heart, but one could study the sysmon code (either from installmaster
script
> or sp_helptext) and determine which rows in sysmonitors correspond to
which data
> elements in the report. Sysmon actually copies this stuff from
sysmonitors into
> a temp table. One could roll their own to copy it into a non-temp table
and
> track for historical purposes, then write their own analysis routines to
massage
> the data.
>
> -Dave
>
>
> J wrote:
>
> > What I'm looking for is a single table containing a large number of
columns
> > (on Col for each measure, in it's underived form)
> > This would include start & end-date, (duration is derived), and then the
> > Total values for each measurement,
> > such as Voluntary yields,
> > Deferred updates,
> > dealocks,
> > lock escalations,
> > etc etc.
> >
> > The whole existing report as we know it then be run as an SP off the
data,
> > and also off historical data.
> > This can now be used as a repository for future reference.
> >
> > I'm in the process to write scripts to parse the sysmon-file, and shove
it
> > into a table, to allow for analysis over time.
> > This would include data to be analysed for one day as we run one 1
minute
> > sysmon every 30 minutes.
> > But this is also very useful to analyse requests etc over a longer
period,
> > susch as one day, etc.
> >
> > Running the sysmons for such a short period allows us to identify spikes
> > easily, as it will show clearly, and may be smoothed over no-activity if
the
> > sysmon was run for a very long period. It also shows us when a database
> > (usually tempdb) has longer checkpoint times .
> > Using this then to graph the results yields REALLY impressive results as
far
> > a visualising the data effects.
> > This still needs a fairly straight head to interpret, but it is REALLY
> > usefull.
> >
> > I'll send you some graphs of what we did at one of my previous sites, if
> > you're interested.
> > This will only contain a subset of all the measures (i.e. the one WE
were
> > interested in), but it should be expanded to all measures (in my
opinion).
> >
> > Let me know if you need more details
> >
> > Cheers
> >
> > J
> >
> > <girish> wrote in message
> > news:AF5DE3EFF8B090CB007579A285256BD1.0034C90785256BD0@webforums...
> > > If you can provide us a little more information on what you're
envisioning
> > > it would help. Are you looking to put the entire
> > > report into a table.
> > > Thanks
> > >
> > > Girish Vaitheeswaran
> > > Staff Software Engineer
> > > Server Performance.
>


Anthony Mandic Posted on 2002-06-22 09:26:43.0Z
Message-ID: <3D1442D3.D47ED1D5@start.com.au>
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Subject: Re: re sysmon dumping it's output into a table ?
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J wrote:
>
> I agree, but the point is that with every new EBF, rollip, or version this
> now has to re-done by ....?

I don't think the table structures would change between EBFs.
With new versions, that might but how often do you change
versions?

-am © 2002


J Posted on 2002-06-26 06:51:18.0Z
From: "J" <rs2@rocketmail.com>
References: <Y9t#JgTDCHA.277@forums.sybase.com> <AF5DE3EFF8B090CB007579A285256BD1.0034C90785256BD0@webforums> <iTztAcFECHA.277@forums.sybase.com> <3D08ED4B.86C8982E@sybase.com> <IMt#hxFGCHA.111@forums.sybase.com> <3D1442D3.D47ED1D5@start.com.au>
Subject: Re: re sysmon dumping it's output into a table ?
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Article PK: 93577

I'm sure the table format would not change that frequently, but the sysmon
procedure code changes quite a bit more frequently,
and it also immediately make this a change to be applied to each server,
which means editing sysmon where the versions do not match.

Because the sysmon code do differ between even minor releases.

Also I think this should be an OPTION, not default, to cater for existing
systems.

And re "new feature", thanks for the info, I'll take the wait and see
approach for that.
Excuse my scepticism, but after hearing about Q for two years I do not get
excited until I actually see something working.

Cheers

J

"Anthony Mandic" <spam_block@start.com.au> wrote in message
news:3D1442D3.D47ED1D5@start.com.au...
> J wrote:
> >
> > I agree, but the point is that with every new EBF, rollip, or version
this
> > now has to re-done by ....?
>
> I don't think the table structures would change between EBFs.
> With new versions, that might but how often do you change
> versions?
>
> -am © 2002


David Wein Posted on 2002-06-21 13:13:54.0Z
Message-ID: <3D132692.A1CA8BED@sybase.com>
Date: Fri, 21 Jun 2002 08:13:54 -0500
From: David Wein <dwein@sybase.com>
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Subject: Re: re sysmon dumping it's output into a table ?
References: <Y9t#JgTDCHA.277@forums.sybase.com> <AF5DE3EFF8B090CB007579A285256BD1.0034C90785256BD0@webforums> <iTztAcFECHA.277@forums.sybase.com> <3D08ED4B.86C8982E@sybase.com> <IMt#hxFGCHA.111@forums.sybase.com>
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Turns out there are plans to provide something very similar (but far more
robust) to your request by the end of the year. I don't want to spill the beans
on it, but I imagine you may be able to hear about it at Techwave this August.
Otherwise, I would expect more details in Q4 of this year.

-Dave

J wrote:

> I agree, but the point is that with every new EBF, rollip, or version this
> now has to re-done by ....?
> It would NOT add a lot of maintenance for Sybase to do this, into a single
> table, using time-of-run relationship to keep the results seperate.
>
> Then you and I and everone out there can start writing weird and wonderful
> reports against a relational table-structure, from which we can manage
> sysmon-over-time data quite a bit easier, thus reducing the cost of
> ownership, and standardising a bit of this process which should've been done
> long ago.
>
> Comments ?
>
> "David Wein" <dwein@sybase.com> wrote in message
> news:3D08ED4B.86C8982E@sybase.com...
> > In a sense this is already done. Sysmon actually takes all of its data
> from the
> > sysmonitors table to begin with and puts it into report form. Not for the
> faint
> > of heart, but one could study the sysmon code (either from installmaster
> script
> > or sp_helptext) and determine which rows in sysmonitors correspond to
> which data
> > elements in the report. Sysmon actually copies this stuff from
> sysmonitors into
> > a temp table. One could roll their own to copy it into a non-temp table
> and
> > track for historical purposes, then write their own analysis routines to
> massage
> > the data.
> >
> > -Dave
> >
> >
> > J wrote:
> >
> > > What I'm looking for is a single table containing a large number of
> columns
> > > (on Col for each measure, in it's underived form)
> > > This would include start & end-date, (duration is derived), and then the
> > > Total values for each measurement,
> > > such as Voluntary yields,
> > > Deferred updates,
> > > dealocks,
> > > lock escalations,
> > > etc etc.
> > >
> > > The whole existing report as we know it then be run as an SP off the
> data,
> > > and also off historical data.
> > > This can now be used as a repository for future reference.
> > >
> > > I'm in the process to write scripts to parse the sysmon-file, and shove
> it
> > > into a table, to allow for analysis over time.
> > > This would include data to be analysed for one day as we run one 1
> minute
> > > sysmon every 30 minutes.
> > > But this is also very useful to analyse requests etc over a longer
> period,
> > > susch as one day, etc.
> > >
> > > Running the sysmons for such a short period allows us to identify spikes
> > > easily, as it will show clearly, and may be smoothed over no-activity if
> the
> > > sysmon was run for a very long period. It also shows us when a database
> > > (usually tempdb) has longer checkpoint times .
> > > Using this then to graph the results yields REALLY impressive results as
> far
> > > a visualising the data effects.
> > > This still needs a fairly straight head to interpret, but it is REALLY
> > > usefull.
> > >
> > > I'll send you some graphs of what we did at one of my previous sites, if
> > > you're interested.
> > > This will only contain a subset of all the measures (i.e. the one WE
> were
> > > interested in), but it should be expanded to all measures (in my
> opinion).
> > >
> > > Let me know if you need more details
> > >
> > > Cheers
> > >
> > > J
> > >
> > > <girish> wrote in message
> > > news:AF5DE3EFF8B090CB007579A285256BD1.0034C90785256BD0@webforums...
> > > > If you can provide us a little more information on what you're
> envisioning
> > > > it would help. Are you looking to put the entire
> > > > report into a table.
> > > > Thanks
> > > >
> > > > Girish Vaitheeswaran
> > > > Staff Software Engineer
> > > > Server Performance.
> >


Anthony Mandic Posted on 2002-06-22 09:27:23.0Z
Message-ID: <3D1442FB.D53FC474@start.com.au>
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Subject: Re: re sysmon dumping it's output into a table ?
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David Wein wrote:
>
> Turns out there are plans to provide something very similar (but far more
> robust) to your request by the end of the year. I don't want to spill the beans
> on it, but I imagine you may be able to hear about it at Techwave this August.
> Otherwise, I would expect more details in Q4 of this year.

On a related topic, what ever happened to Q (or SDTC)?

-am © 2002


David Wein Posted on 2002-06-26 14:12:30.0Z
Message-ID: <3D19CBCE.61B733B2@sybase.com>
Date: Wed, 26 Jun 2002 09:12:30 -0500
From: David Wein <dwein@sybase.com>
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Subject: Re: re sysmon dumping it's output into a table ?
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I believe it was a multi-vendor situation that didn't work out.

-Dave

Anthony Mandic wrote:

> David Wein wrote:
> >
> > Turns out there are plans to provide something very similar (but far more
> > robust) to your request by the end of the year. I don't want to spill the beans
> > on it, but I imagine you may be able to hear about it at Techwave this August.
> > Otherwise, I would expect more details in Q4 of this year.
>
> On a related topic, what ever happened to Q (or SDTC)?
>
> -am © 2002


Carl Kayser Posted on 2002-06-14 13:57:41.0Z
From: "Carl Kayser" <kayser_c@bls.gov>
References: <Y9t#JgTDCHA.277@forums.sybase.com> <AF5DE3EFF8B090CB007579A285256BD1.0034C90785256BD0@webforums> <iTztAcFECHA.277@forums.sybase.com> <3D08ED4B.86C8982E@sybase.com>
Subject: Re: re sysmon dumping it's output into a table ?
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Yes. I've done it (so it's not too hard to do!). Add on sequence and/or
datetime columns to the "permanent sysmonitors" for time-series history.
Then just crank it back out to #tempmonitors within a stored procedure and
execute the desired sp_sysmon subroutines. (Nice re-use of existing code.)
One improvement is that any or all sub-reports can be specified for a
sequence number in a character argument. (Why sp_sysmon does all or one but
not "some" is a mystery to me.)

The headache is in looking at time-series sub-reports. Now you have to
tweak copies of each of the sp_sysmon subroutines. They have to (1) use
your permanent table, (2) possibly adjust the outputs to eliminate
wraparound/scrolling, and (3) possibly adjust for data sub-hierarchies. I
have found this to be time consuming since I have to do code comparisons
owing to bug fixes and new output formats. On the other hand I have found
it to be more informative (various time-dependent "spikes" obviously stand
out) than the "sp_sysmon on demand" described in the first paragraph and one
becomes much more familiar with the various outputs. Also one finds more
sp_sysmon bugs this way.

"David Wein" <dwein@sybase.com> wrote in message
news:3D08ED4B.86C8982E@sybase.com...
> In a sense this is already done. Sysmon actually takes all of its data
from the
> sysmonitors table to begin with and puts it into report form. Not for the
faint
> of heart, but one could study the sysmon code (either from installmaster
script
> or sp_helptext) and determine which rows in sysmonitors correspond to
which data
> elements in the report. Sysmon actually copies this stuff from
sysmonitors into
> a temp table. One could roll their own to copy it into a non-temp table
and
> track for historical purposes, then write their own analysis routines to
massage
> the data.
>
> -Dave
>
>
> J wrote:
>
> > What I'm looking for is a single table containing a large number of
columns
> > (on Col for each measure, in it's underived form)
> > This would include start & end-date, (duration is derived), and then the
> > Total values for each measurement,
> > such as Voluntary yields,
> > Deferred updates,
> > dealocks,
> > lock escalations,
> > etc etc.
> >
> > The whole existing report as we know it then be run as an SP off the
data,
> > and also off historical data.
> > This can now be used as a repository for future reference.
> >
> > I'm in the process to write scripts to parse the sysmon-file, and shove
it
> > into a table, to allow for analysis over time.
> > This would include data to be analysed for one day as we run one 1
minute
> > sysmon every 30 minutes.
> > But this is also very useful to analyse requests etc over a longer
period,
> > susch as one day, etc.
> >
> > Running the sysmons for such a short period allows us to identify spikes
> > easily, as it will show clearly, and may be smoothed over no-activity if
the
> > sysmon was run for a very long period. It also shows us when a database
> > (usually tempdb) has longer checkpoint times .
> > Using this then to graph the results yields REALLY impressive results as
far
> > a visualising the data effects.
> > This still needs a fairly straight head to interpret, but it is REALLY
> > usefull.
> >
> > I'll send you some graphs of what we did at one of my previous sites, if
> > you're interested.
> > This will only contain a subset of all the measures (i.e. the one WE
were
> > interested in), but it should be expanded to all measures (in my
opinion).
> >
> > Let me know if you need more details
> >
> > Cheers
> >
> > J
> >
> > <girish> wrote in message
> > news:AF5DE3EFF8B090CB007579A285256BD1.0034C90785256BD0@webforums...
> > > If you can provide us a little more information on what you're
envisioning
> > > it would help. Are you looking to put the entire
> > > report into a table.
> > > Thanks
> > >
> > > Girish Vaitheeswaran
> > > Staff Software Engineer
> > > Server Performance.
>


Fuesun Bakioglu Posted on 2002-06-11 11:23:29.0Z
From: "Fuesun Bakioglu" <fuesun@cerberus-consulting.de>
References: <Y9t#JgTDCHA.277@forums.sybase.com> <AF5DE3EFF8B090CB007579A285256BD1.0034C90785256BD0@webforums> <iTztAcFECHA.277@forums.sybase.com>
Subject: Re: re sysmon dumping it's output into a table ?
Date: Tue, 11 Jun 2002 13:23:29 +0200
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Article PK: 93627

Check the following link :
http://www.cerberus-consulting.com/products/csa/index.htm

"J" <rs2@rocketmail.com> wrote in message
news:iTztAcFECHA.277@forums.sybase.com...
> What I'm looking for is a single table containing a large number of
columns
> (on Col for each measure, in it's underived form)
> This would include start & end-date, (duration is derived), and then the
> Total values for each measurement,
> such as Voluntary yields,
> Deferred updates,
> dealocks,
> lock escalations,
> etc etc.
>
> The whole existing report as we know it then be run as an SP off the data,
> and also off historical data.
> This can now be used as a repository for future reference.
>
> I'm in the process to write scripts to parse the sysmon-file, and shove it
> into a table, to allow for analysis over time.
> This would include data to be analysed for one day as we run one 1 minute
> sysmon every 30 minutes.
> But this is also very useful to analyse requests etc over a longer period,
> susch as one day, etc.
>
> Running the sysmons for such a short period allows us to identify spikes
> easily, as it will show clearly, and may be smoothed over no-activity if
the
> sysmon was run for a very long period. It also shows us when a database
> (usually tempdb) has longer checkpoint times .
> Using this then to graph the results yields REALLY impressive results as
far
> a visualising the data effects.
> This still needs a fairly straight head to interpret, but it is REALLY
> usefull.
>
> I'll send you some graphs of what we did at one of my previous sites, if
> you're interested.
> This will only contain a subset of all the measures (i.e. the one WE were
> interested in), but it should be expanded to all measures (in my opinion).
>
> Let me know if you need more details
>
> Cheers
>
> J
>
>
> <girish> wrote in message
> news:AF5DE3EFF8B090CB007579A285256BD1.0034C90785256BD0@webforums...
> > If you can provide us a little more information on what you're
envisioning
> > it would help. Are you looking to put the entire
> > report into a table.
> > Thanks
> >
> > Girish Vaitheeswaran
> > Staff Software Engineer
> > Server Performance.
>
>